# DEMS receipt WW11



## sandrabarling (Jan 16, 2014)

The attached was in my late father Ray Dodd belongings. He served on DEMS during WW11. It seems to refer to some sort of earnings over and above his DEMS pay. I know he was in America. Unfortunately there is no year date on the receipt. Would be really grateful if anyone can throw any light on this slip of paper.
Sandra


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## Ivor Lloyd (Jul 18, 2005)

sandrabarling said:


> The attached was in my late father Ray Dodd belongings. He served on DEMS during WW11. It seems to refer to some sort of earnings over and above his DEMS pay. I know he was in America. Unfortunately there is no year date on the receipt. Would be really grateful if anyone can throw any light on this slip of paper.
> Sandra


Those were the days FOUR Dollars Plus to the Pound


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## IAN M (Jan 17, 2009)

A difficult one, Sandra, particulary due to the lack of a date. Many British Liberty Ships were built/assembled in Baltimore, Maryland. Their names all began with the prefix SAM and he may have joined one there. I joined the SAMITE there in 1943 and we were back in Baltimore in 1944 to be repaired. On that second visit we were required to keep sabotage watches, but, on my ship, only the officers were involved. As a radio officer, I kept a sabotage watch, but this was an unpaid duty. 

DEMS gunners (Maritime Regiment, Royal Artillery) signed on Ships' Articles as Deck Hands - at the usual supernumerary rate of 1/- a month - as this gave them civilian status under International Law so that they would not be interned if the ship chanced to enter a neutral port. Regretably, I have been unable to get copies of the Articles of the two ships I served on during the war, and think most, if not all, have been destroyed. 

Perhaps your next move should be to contact the Royal Artillery, as they will have his Army record and may be able to supply ships' names, but I wouldn't bet on the latter. 

Regards

Ian


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## Hugh MacLean (Nov 18, 2005)

Sandra,

With regard to the records, if he was DEMS MRA, there may be a maritime card held with his service record stating which MN ships he served in. In my experience though this card, in lots of cases, does not survive and only his shore postings are shown. The only way to trace him in that instance would be through crew agreements but the snag is you need to know the name of one of his ships preferably from the end of his service.

He could of course have been DEMS RN, they are still difficult to research but there is a good chance his MN ships are recorded on his Pay & Victualing ledger. If not, then the same procedure is required as per the DEMS MRA and use crew agreements from a known ship.

Ian, I can't recall if we have discussed crew agreements in the past but there is a 1944 crew agreement for SAMITE held at Kew in piece BT 381/3160. I can't recall off the top of my head what your other ship was but there should be an agreement at Kew.

Regards
Hugh


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## IAN M (Jan 17, 2009)

Ian, I can't recall if we have discussed crew agreements in the past but there is a 1944 crew agreement for SAMITE held at Kew in piece BT 381/3160. I can't recall off the top of my head what your other ship was but there should be an agreement at Kew.

Regards
Hugh[/QUOTE]

Thanks Hugh, but that will be for the voyage following mine as we signed on on 6th July 1943 and signed off on 17 October 1944. My next ship was the SAMFORTH which we signed on on 5 December 1944 and signed off on 6 October 1945. Many years ago, when Agreements were held in Cardiff, I was told they weren't available.

Regards

Ian


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## Hugh MacLean (Nov 18, 2005)

Hi Ian,
The crew agreement should record all voyages undertaken in 1944 so I would be reasonably confident you would find your name in the Articles of Agreement. The same goes for SAMFORTH official number 169800. For year 1944, it's BT 381/3169 and for year 1945, it's BT 381/3705. As you signed on in December 1944, I would expect you to be mentioned in the 1945 crew agreement.

For Sandra, I see from another post that your dad was RN DEMS and that you have the P & V record does it not mention any ships? I note you mention in another post that he was on the DEVIS when she was lost in 1943.

Regards
Hugh


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## Bill Morrison (May 25, 2013)

IAN M said:


> Ian, I can't recall if we have discussed crew agreements in the past but there is a 1944 crew agreement for SAMITE held at Kew in piece BT 381/3160. I can't recall off the top of my head what your other ship was but there should be an agreement at Kew.
> 
> Regards
> Hugh


Thanks Hugh, but that will be for the voyage following mine as we signed on on 6th July 1943 and signed off on 17 October 1944. My next ship was the SAMFORTH which we signed on on 5 December 1944 and signed off on 6 October 1945. Many years ago, when Agreements were held in Cardiff, I was told they weren't available.

Regards

Ian[/QUOTE]

It's a small world these days Ian. I have just received my monthly catalogue of old shipping books and while browsing through it this caught my eye.


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## IAN M (Jan 17, 2009)

Bill Morrison;
It's a small world these days Ian. I have just received my monthly catalogue of old shipping books and while browsing through it this caught my eye.[/QUOTE said:


> That's my book, Bill.
> 
> Regard
> 
> Ian


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## Michael Wardell (Aug 21, 2010)

IAN M said:


> That's my book, Bill.
> 
> Regard
> 
> Ian



Just bought a copy. What an informative read. I am researching the service of my wife's late father - Rob Hultgren who was an engineer on the Samite in the next voyage after you signed off. He was previously on the Samneva when it was torpedoed. He later went on Mill Hill which had also been a Liberty ship. Anyone who can supply any info or memories of Rob would be gratefully received by his descendants.


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