# CW in the roaring forties amateur band



## King Ratt

If anyone has a comms receiver, there is some good morse to be heard around 7018 Khz. The operators seem to be ex R/Os with plenty of marine type exchanges. Some mention of ship call letters mentioned yesterday, GPLC and GYXG being two of them. Are these familiar c/s to anyone?


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## GW3OQK

Maritime Radio Day
http://maritimeradio.pro/maritimeradioday/mrd-rules.htm

I was there, GW3OQK ex GMSN
73
Andrew


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## King Ratt

Thank you Andrew. I enjoyed that morse. I don't have an amateur license for UK but used to be VP8ARR from the Falklands in 82/83. Had many a good QSO both CW and SSB and still have the log I kept from those days.

73

KR


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## GW3OQK

KR, you ought to get a licence, I understand its not difficult these days. I got mine when I was a teenager and built my own TX. R1155 RX. Then WOW! I discovered I could go to sea and do what I liked best, radio and messing about with electronics. I am still doing it
73
Andrew


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## King Ratt

Andrew. I might well do that in due course. I still possess a nice Marconi up and down key and give it a bit of attention into an audio oscillator to keep my fist in. I would be quite content to have a QRP transmitter and stick purely to CW. 
73

KR (Rab T)


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## Tony Selman

Rab, I presume what you heard was Maritime Radio Day but 7017 Khz is the frequency used the Radio amateur section of the ROA on their weekly skeds at 1930 on thursdays. Equally lots of maritime chat on there as well.


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## King Ratt

Thank you, Tony. I will tune in. 

73

Rab T


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## david.hopcroft

I missed his c/s, but heard someone called Geoff working G0LKI on 7024khz saying he was on GDDT in 1944 - I was born in 1944 !!!! It was good morse too.

David

I have struggled to hear anyone/thing on 14052 or 21052. Has it been very flat this year ?

+


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## King Ratt

I hear the occasional VK in the morning around 0830 to 0900 on the 20 metre band.


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## Troppo

A General Cert, a 1st or a 2nd class should enable you to get an amateur licence...or at least get an exemption on the theory test?

It certainly does in VK....


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## Chris Jenkins

Troppo said:


> A General Cert, a 1st or a 2nd class should enable you to get an amateur licence...or at least get an exemption on the theory test?
> 
> It certainly does in VK....


Thats interesting....does anyone from UK know if that is the case ?


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## Chris Jenkins

R651400 said:


> Rescinded a long time ago and I doubt if today's Ofcom would know what a PMG or MRGC ticket is!
> Most prospective amateurs go via the Foundation route which should present no difficulties to an ex RO then progress from there to Intermediate and then Advanced Amateur.
> For KR.. Scotland just might have a new ITU international call letter allocation in the near future which will make it a much sought after country for a contact.
> If the present Intermediate still allocates the 2E series call sign I'd personally stick with that rather than go full Advanced.
> 73
> F5VBU/GM3UIN


Thanks a lot.....I hope you join the amateur ranks this year.


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## King Ratt

I did enquire years ago about getting a Uk amateur licence on production of my PMG but was told I would have to sit the amateur exam. In 1982 got my Falkland licence on producing the same ticket at Stanley Post Office.
R651400's comments on an independent Scotland are noted!


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## G4UMW

You didn't get an exemption from the Morse test either.

I've just found my Morse test pass slip; the signature looks like A. Busby and is dated 1st August 1983. I took the test at Companies House in London. On completion, I was told, unofficially, that I'd passed; the examiner then said "Mind you, if you'd failed I would have kicked your a**e!". He then showed me his clipboard - included with my personal details was my MRGC number which I hadn't mentioned when applying for the test.


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## hawkey01

Ron,

yes it would have been A. Busby - Tony - he was originally at GKA then moved onward within BT.

Hawkey01


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## King Ratt

For R651400. Thanks for that info. I will give them a try.

73

KR


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## G4UMW

Thanks for that Neville.


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## Troppo

G4UMW said:


> You didn't get an exemption from the Morse test either.
> 
> I've just found my Morse test pass slip; the signature looks like A. Busby and is dated 1st August 1983. I took the test at Companies House in London. On completion, I was told, unofficially, that I'd passed; the examiner then said "Mind you, if you'd failed I would have kicked your a**e!". He then showed me his clipboard - included with my personal details was my MRGC number which I hadn't mentioned when applying for the test.


Sorry, but that is just ridiculous.

Why the hell would they require an amateur morse test if you held a commercial ticket?


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## Troppo

R651400 said:


> KR...Ofcom are very accommodating and it wouldn't surprise me any Commonwealth or Colonial call-sign of the past if you can produce the paper-work may give you reciprocation to a full GB licence without further ado. Worth a try!


There are always ways around the bureaucracy....


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## Troppo

R651400 said:


> Rescinded a long time ago and I doubt if today's Ofcom would know what a PMG or MRGC ticket is!
> Most prospective amateurs go via the Foundation route which should present no difficulties to an ex RO then progress from there to Intermediate and then Advanced Amateur.
> 
> 73
> F5VBU/GM3UIN


It is worth _asking_ Ofcom if they will grant a licence on the basis of your ticket. 

Nothing ventured....


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## freddythefrog

OFCOM will not except PMG/MRGC etc as an exemption for an amateur licence
but only over the past few years you have been able to get an exemption from the morse test only! However, the Irish Licence WILL accept your pmg's etc.
(need an address in EIRE) and then you can get reciprocal---end of story.
My friend and I have had a lot of qso's with OFCOM in the past years, sent them pmg/radar/c and g past papers/phone calls but they would not have it.
Then they issue exam(amateur) performance figures and only 2 people taking the exam knew how to wire a 13 amp plug correctly!!!!!
The mind boggles!! When my friend an ex R/O took the morse test the 2 examiners kept telling him to SLOW down as they could not read his morse!!
I was sitting in the next room laughing my head off I could read it no bother at all. He rattled it off at around 25 WPM. They really are a joke!!
regards FTF


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## Troppo

Ofcom are the most amateurish regulators I have had the misfortune to encounter.

And I say that as an ex regulator myself.

To not accept a marine ticket for complete exemption to an amateur licence is scandalous.

But, having dealt with the professionals (ha!) in Ofcom, I am not surprised...


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## Troppo

But why would they rescind the exemption????

This makes no sense whatsoever.....it is like something out of Yes Minister.


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## GW3OQK

I dont think anyone should be exempted from the radio amateur exam as it is an international qualification. Should be very easy for anyone who believes they are already sufficiently qualified. Here's a link about how to do it. http://www.hamlife.co.uk/categoryRender.asp?categoryID=3653 

I visited a couple of radio clubs recently to meet some locals and found only one person in each who used morse. Am I antisocial because I prefer to communicate with fellow amateurs by key rather than by voice? 
73
Andrew


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## Troppo

With the greatest possible respect, rubbish!

I have held a full call (advanced) licence since 1979, and I have never sat an amateur exam.

Asking a serving Radio Officer to sit an amateur exam would have been a grievous insult. 

The theory, practical and regs knowledge required for a MRGC/1st/2nd class is so far above that required for amateur radio, it is not funny.

And I'm talking _real _amateur radio - essay style theory exams - not the back of a cornflakes packet, multiple guess glorified CB drivel we have today.

73
VK4DU


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## Troppo

Exams in VK have been run by the regulator for many years - they are now run by the amateur organisation (WIA), but under close control of the regulator.

You poms make me shake my head at times....


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## trotterdotpom

I just looked at the Hamlife site recommended by EXRO ... 5 wpm? Please!!!
It would take all night to say: "I am a 13 year old girl with blond hair and I like playing with my Barbie dolls."

Maybe I'm not cut out to be a radio ham. Actually, I'm thinking of returning to letter writing .... I still write to an old friend in South Africa, maybe she could put me in touch with someone so I could become a Black Ham operator. Wonder if my old qualifications would be acceptable.

John T


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## Troppo

Elitist! Ha! That hoary old chestnut....

(Jester)


One of my favourite subjects. The decline of amateur radio.

The standing of amateur radio with the people who really matter (i.e. the regulators) has been irreparably damaged by the introduction of the FL.

Why do I say this? Because I attend the ITU regularly as a member of the Aust. delegation. I was also a Director of the WIA - the Aussie version of the RSGB when the FL was introduced.

In the days when AR was a technical hobby (a hobby that required you to possess a modi*** of technical skill and be able to communicate same in writing), many of the delegates to ITU were also amateurs. 

This tended to garner a lot of informal support for AR, such that many amateur issues were sometimes treated leniently, with a bit of a nod and a wink. 

These days, it is very rare to find an amateur on a delegation. Many delegates to ITU actively dislike AR. The many corridor discussions I have had all point to the dumbing down of the hobby as a serious negative. It is seen as glorified CB by many professionals these days. 

The amateurs attending ITU on behalf of their national societies have a torrid time getting new proposals up. The 5MHz band is a very good example - there is serious opposition to it from many countries.

This is the same as other AR issues - as demand on the spectrum increases (mobile data, connected devices, etc), it is inevitable that one of the services will have to give ground - and it will be AR.

The community service aspect of AR is just about non-existent in VK. Gone are the days where emergency services would call on amateurs for comms support in times of crisis. Redundant, linked networks and portable comms systems have put paid to AR support.

We have hastened our own demise by fundamentally changing the nature of our hobby.


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## J. Davies

I am active on Radio Maritime day whenever I can...missed it this year.

Amateur Radio licenses ....yes Ofcom seem somewhat difficult.

In Singapore I got a full amateur license on the strength of an MRGC. The local authority are very friendly and helpful (IDA).

I did have to sit a 15-minute multiple choice question on amateur radio regulations (is 14 Mhz and amateur band? Yes or No etc...) followed by a cup of coffee with the examiner.

But if I ever returned to UK and wanted a G-amateur license I would have to sit the full RAE... there is no reciprocal agreement between Singapore and UK....

John 9V1VV


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## freddythefrog

Maybe if all guys who wish to get a licence for amateur bands and could not be bothered by going back to theory 40 years ago All apply for Irish licences with the pmg and mrgc tickets and then apply for reciprocal U.K. licence then surely OFCOM may sit up and rethink its policies.(Hopefully)
When my friend and I qso'd with them years ago the head of department was a woman who only worked 2 and half days a week and knew sweet FA about
radio and she turned round and said to us we were not qualified enough for an amateur licence based on 1st class PMG's, Radar ticket and C and G Full tech Certs and years of experience using marine radio gear at sea.!!
We had to sit the full theory test and the morse test to get on amateur bands!! My friend also got an Irish licence and requested a reciprocal uk licence just to show them the system was flawed, OFCOM is jobs for the boys and girls unfortunately. cheers FTF


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## Troppo

R651400 said:


> To not expect change which involves dilution of old standards eg fundamental radio theory and morse tests etc to become a radio amateur is archaic.
> Had the old examination standards continued the hobby would be as dead as the proverbial dodo years ago,.


I was right in the middle of all this in my time at the WIA.

Yes, we had to move away from essay style exams - you can make multiple choice exams quite tricky if you want - but diluting the theory to the point where a one day course is sufficient just devalues the entire hobby.

AR is supposed to be a technical pursuit....


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## endure

freddythefrog said:


> OFCOM will not except PMG/MRGC etc as an exemption for an amateur licence
> but only over the past few years you have been able to get an exemption from the morse test only!


I passed my MRGC 40 years ago. Why should Ofcom assume that I know the current set of regulations and syllabus for an exam that I've never taken? BTW the requirement to pass a morse test stopped in July 2003. If you didn't know that how can you consider yourself qualified to operate an amateur station under the current rules?


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## Troppo

R651400 said:


> It still is and I'm with you on that.
> My bone of contention is how commercial AR has become with equipment costing thousands of pounds.
> This certainly has come about by simplifying entry into the hobby and the resulting increase in the number of amateurs world-wide.


That's the problem. To be realistic, the average amateur isn't going to build his own equipment these days, but she/he should at least have a knowledge of radio technology, backed by good op skills.

Listening around the bands, it is painfully obvious that many amateurs don't really understand antenna theory and how to adjust their equipment for a clean signal.

Operating standards have dropped to a miserable level, particularly in contests and during DX-peditions...courtesy and good manners often go out the proverbial window. Some of it is truly cringeworthy.

There is still some experimentation taking place on the 144 MHz and above bands, and SDR techniques are being pioneered by a very small group of amateurs, but they are the exception rather than the rule...and of course, HF (with lots of LIDs) will be monitored by the regulators....


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## trotterdotpom

endure said:


> I passed my MRGC 40 years ago. Why should Ofcom assume that I know the current set of regulations and syllabus for an exam that I've never taken? BTW the requirement to pass a morse test stopped in July 2003. If you didn't know that how can you consider yourself qualified to operate an amateur station under the current rules?


I certainly don't know the Amateur regulations, I can't even work out any of the abbreviations that are being bandied about (although it just dawned on me that AR must be Amateur Radio).

Presume "Ofcom" is some sort of governing body, but it sounds like a bit of the old Cockney backslang.

John T


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## Troppo

Ofcom is the pommy version of ACMA.


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## trotterdotpom

Troppo said:


> Ofcom is the pommy version of ACMA.


ACMA? Is that shampoo?

John T


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## Cisco

No, its a skin condition that dyslexic antipodean hams suffer from....

'Fraid I bought all my radios...... doesn't make me a bad person....built me own antenna farm but...

Cisco 
VK3JFH/VP8DNM


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## endure

Troppo said:


> There is still some experimentation taking place on the 144 MHz and above bands,


Also now on 136 KHz and 472 KHz


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## 5TT

Troppo,



> Operating standards have dropped to a miserable level


This might be true of SSB operators, I wouldn't know, the dog buried my microphones years ago, but if you stick to CW there are plenty of really good, slick operators out there, it's a pleasure to work most of them.



> but she/he should at least have a knowledge of radio technology


This I agree with and it is a worry. I originally thought it was just here in South Africa but I have since learned from the other forums that I subscribe to that the problem is global and I believe it will ultimately cost us in terms of spectrum allocation, maximum power levels etc, it's a real shame.

Once again though it seems to be the CW chaps who are the most competent technically.

= Adrian / ZS1TTZ / M0GNC +


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## ex ro

I took the Foundation Licence in Nov 2012 there was still a morse test at 5 wpm now I can go on the air with 10 watts, only use CW but go on the air most days and have had some great DX QSOs it has been great fun.
I found that at the club that I attended there was zero interest in CW they were only interested in FM and SSB the more technically minded in Packet Radio.
what has amazed me is the age of some of CW hams many are well into their 80s and some even in to their nineties. As an ex seagoing R/O and ETO for over 20 years serving on all types of ships, the exam is a joke and I firmly believe that OFCOM should give dispensations for all ex Radio Officers who have Special first or 2nd PMG or MRGC and who wish to use their hard fought skills again. The great thing is you can always tell an ex R/O on the air by the way they operate 73s


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## Troppo

5TT said:


> Troppo,
> 
> Once again though it seems to be the CW chaps who are the most competent technically.
> 
> = Adrian / ZS1TTZ / M0GNC +


Oh! A heretic! 



Spot on. I only work CW, and it is fine as you say.

(Thumb)

73


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## King Ratt

I did not think my thread would raise such interest and so many comments. My only addition to this thread is that I believe all amateur operators should have to pass a morse test at 12 wpm or greater. That would prove that they really were interested in the hobby and not just expanding, the Lord forbid, an enhanced CB culture.
Happy Easter to you all.

KR


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## Cisco

Hmmmmm... I did it at 5wpm.... but was examined in morse by lamp for 2nd mates and mates... sadly I think there is a left lobe/right lobe issue when you try to go from eye to ear.

So... I don't work CW but I am active on a couple of maritime nets esp the Comedy Net.... I also muck around with a fair bit of digital stuff.... mainly QRP... PSK, WSPR, JT65 ... also interested in DRM using an ELAD SDR....

VK3JFH/VP8DNM/and a Chilean call I never activated cos I had to present meself in Orsorno to pick it up when I was down in TdF...


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## Cisco

I believe OAPs aka OFs over a certain age have to be re-tested if they wish to retain their driving licences... maybe the same should be enforced by Ofcom/AMSA/ etc.... OAP/OF operators should be obliged to demonstrate a good working knowledge of all matters digital.... and I'm not talking about visits to their proctologists.....


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## 5TT

> A qualified GP full of the joys of spring at becoming an amateur took his morse and failed.


The 12 wpm morse requirement wasn't enforced as rigorously in all organisations. There are hams here in SA who were licensed when 12 wpm morse was a requirement but have clearly never been able to send and receive at all, and at least one of those that I know personally was appointed by the SARL as an official morse examiner. He claimed to use a computer to conduct the tests and when I asked him about the copy he said "oh I can hear if it sounds right". So, all you needed to do was seek out one of these "specialists", possibly bearing the odd screw topped gift or two and your certificate of competence was a certainty.

= Adrian +


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## GW3OQK

Any ex r/os here who can answer all these advanced level questions then?! http://rsgb.org/main/files/2012/11/Advanced_Sample_Paper_1.pdf

Anybody fancy revalidating their PMG?

About CB types, I was tuning my Atalanta towards the Roaring 40 m band when I came across real prats about 6.6 MHz. They seen to be on air on a Sunday afternoon, with quite recognisable accents. I guess they dont care about licences anyway and dont have the brains for even the entry level licence. 

73
Andrew GW3OQK


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## King Ratt

Oh dear EXRO, I have just failed, miserably! 
Regarding the 6 mhz idiots, they need identified and removed from their pastime.

Happy Easter.

KR


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## trotterdotpom

I get confused by the jiggling between metres and megacycles, how can I be expected to answer that test?

I'm sharpening my fountain pen.

John T

PS Whoops, make that megaherz.


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## freddythefrog

I do believe in years gone by that the ROA did approach the OFCOM regarding
marine exams and think it was down to the ROA that their negotiations managed to get exemption from the morse tests only.
Tony Selman please can you enlarge on The ROA negotiations from some years back---and also the outcome. Many thanks regards FTF


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## ex ro

It has always struck me as an absurd way of rewarding greater examination achievement in terms of amateur radio by allowing more power to the operator ie Foundation licence 10 Watts Intermediate 50 watts and Full or Advanced 400 Watts, when operating it takes more skill and knowledge of conditions etc to achieve the same results as someone using say 400 watts with 10 watts or less in QRP operations, so if you can do more with less why bother moving on from the basic licence?


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## Cisco

ex ro said:


> so if you can do more with less why bother moving on from the basic licence?


So that you can work on more bands?


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## ex ro

you can work all the bands with the foundation licence it is only the power levels that differ!


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## Troppo

Not in VK, thank goodness.


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## Tony Selman

ftf, I am afraid I cannot enlighten you on that one. Certainly not whilst I have been in the chair, however, I will enquire of my predecessor and see what he has to say.


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## freddythefrog

Tony Selman
Many thanks Tony regards FTF


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## endure

R651400 said:


> But not a joke to those with zero radio experience. I'm a member of a Scottish radio club whose president GM4UYZ and member MM0DXC have possibly introduced AR and gained more Foundation level passes to candidates than any other AR club in the UK.
> I don't think Ofcom would be interested in re-introducing PMG or MRGC exemption unless they were seriously approached by a professional body and I think the best representation would be via the ROA.


When was the last MRGC ticket issued? Wouldn't Ofcom be catering to a vanishing market? 

Apart from that if the amateur exams are so easy what's the problem about taking them? I took the last C&G exam in 2003. I didn't feel it an affront to my professional dignity. I wanted to go on the air again so I just got on with it.


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## ex ro

That would be exactly the reason for considering dispensations for former r/o s the fact that the average age must now be well over 65 and it would help to preserve cw for a few more years on the airwaves


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## endure

ex ro said:


> That would be exactly the reason for considering dispensations for former r/o s the fact that the average age must now be well over 65 and it would help to preserve cw for a few more years on the airwaves



Sorry I don't want special treatment just because I've managed to avoid dying lol. 

The number of amateurs learning CW has actually gone up since the CW test was removed from the exam.


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## ex ro

Sorry with all due respect to you, this is not about you , you have as you say already have the licence, this is about others who for whatever reason may not be as fortunate or indeed as smug as yourself. In my experience there are very few new amateurs who have the will or interest to learn morse, at a greater speed than the 5wpm that still exists for the Foundation Licence although it is usually "flogged" as indeed is the practical element in both the Foundation and Intermediate licences.


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## Tony Selman

A mini update for you. My predecessor does not know and cannot remember if the ROA historically obtained exemptions. However, it is the ROA reunion at the weekend and one of our members works for Ofcom and might perhaps know. I will let you know what I find out.


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## King Ratt

Author unknown.

THE R/O’s LAMENT

In a cold and lonely radio shack, where the last receiver stands,
A museum set of manuals held idly in my hands,
With my jargon half forgotten, of my stock-in-trade bereft,
I wonder what's ahead of me - the only Sparkie left.

The shack is sprouting gadgets almost everywhere I see,
There are keyboards for computers, where my Morse key used to be.
But I couldn't read steam morse ‘midst this lunatic array,
For at every height and angle there's a visual display.

The proud, efficient Sparkie has been rendered obsolete
By electronic equipment fitted in the Merchant Fleet,
And tho' a signal's through the system in the blinking of an ee,
No-one's got the time, to even make a cup of tea.

To delete the human error, to erase a noble breed,
We rely upon a microchip, we put our faith in speed.
We press a key, and make a switch, and spin a little disc,
it's certainly efficient - and never mind the risk.

But again I may be needed, for the time will surely come
When there's a fault within the system and the modern stuff is dumb,
When the satellites are useless but morse is there for free -
T’was good enough for old Marconi, and it's good enough for me.


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## King Ratt

Regarding an earlier post about unauthorised transmissions in the 6 mhz region. I have just heard two foul mouthed users on 6625 Khz just 3 Khz above Shanwick Oceanic 6622 frequency. These idiots need identified and shut down. They both sounded like Cornwall or Devonian accents but otherwise no idents.


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## Searcher2004

Tony Selman said:


> A mini update for you. My predecessor does not know and cannot remember if the ROA historically obtained exemptions. However, it is the ROA reunion at the weekend and one of our members works for Ofcom and might perhaps know. I will let you know what I find out.


Hi Guys,

I thought that I had some info on exemptions to the RAE/Morse Test and had a dig around. I have a copy of a War Office file that covers Army Council Instructions relating to Amateur Radio and inserted there is a letter from the GPO dated 28th Oct 1954 which includes a list of exemptions, both civilian and military. Unfortunately, I can't get the scans to load on this site, so I will summarise the civvy exemptions:-

Exemption from the RAE:-

1st or 2nd Class PMG 
MTCA equivalent for aircraft radio officers

Exemption from Morse Test:-

1st, 2nd or Special PMG
MTCA equivalents. 

The military list is considerably longer.

Now, when this lapsed I don't know but it wasn't in force in the early to mid 1960s when I did my RAE/MT, getting my ham ticket in mid-66 and when at radio college 66-67 I never heard a mention of such exemptions. I can scan through a few years of the RSGB Bulletin for more info on when the exemptions were removed, if anyone is interested. 

73

Roger/G3VKM


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## Searcher2004

R651400 said:


> All PMG and HM Forces exemptions for the RAE that were available in 1956 had expired by 1963 when I joined the GPO coastal radio service.


OK, that narrows it down, I'm interested to see why the exemptions were removed.


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## ex ro

R651400 said:


> I really can't say and agree with you on vanishing market but ex ro has a point and I reiterate the ROA and possibly the RSGB would be the only people to provide sufficient 'skelp' to persuade Ofcom to re-introduce R/O exemption.
> Let's face it entry into the GB amateur radio world could not be easier via Foundation and the Advanced multiple choice test example by ex ro shows a very high degree of amateur theory and technical knowledge. I'd also like to clarify the Foundation licence has no morse test as we know it ie sending/receiving.
> I'm a cw contest nut and will defend the mode to the bitter end but I was lucky to be professionally taught and I've already posted the sad sight of one amateur candidate circa '65 failing his morse test at GND vowing never to return to the hobby.
> Perhaps a tad draconian but I wonder during this era how many more morse failures went down the same road.


i am sorry to have to disagree with you but I took the Foundation Exam in November 2012 and had to take a morse sending and receiving test there is no test for the higher levels just a basic test for whatever reason at the basic level,.
73s alan


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## ex ro

Now you are spot on there is only test for foundation no other level this gives an M6 prefix, and the ability to operate on all bands with 10 watts max. As an aside last year my local club decided to celebrate the demise of the TItanic by going /MM on a local ferry service to Ireland on which I had served as Radio Officer for 15 years and my last ship was the sister ship to this one on which I served as the seagoing ÉTO they asked me to go as the cw operator the activities would take place in the defunct yet complete radio room using the clubs radio equipment however I would only be allowed to operate in the presence of a full licence holder irrespective of whether he could read or send morse or not needless to say I declined the kind invitation .


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## G4UMW

As far as I know it's Morse _Appreciation_ for the Foundation licence (5 wpm with the aid of a crib sheet). There is no Morse requirement whatsoever for the Intermediate or Advanced licences.

G4UMW (former RSGB Morse examiner when such were required!)


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## endure

There's been no requirement to pass a morse test since 2003.


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## Searcher2004

R651400 said:


> As I mentioned previously I missed out on the exemption in 1956 and I've a feeling the termination of this privilege in 1963 may have something to do with the end of National Service.
> Memory (for what it is) tells me PMG's 1 & 2 always carried RAE exemption but when National Service came along the privilege was extended to HM Forces with "equivalent qualifications."
> At the end of National Service the exemption privilege disappeared in my view thru WPB governmental procedure without thought to what had gone pre National Service!!
> I see no reason with the right authoritative approach exemption for PMG/MRGC holders cannot be resurrected.
> Nothing ventured nothing gained...


I asked on the VMARS members site and someone there recalled the date of the scheme finishing as May 8th 1958 but the GPO had proposed back in mid-1956 that the scheme stop and the RSGB rasied no objection. The magazines of the time refer only to "Services" but I would imagine that catch-all included the Merchant Navy as there is no mention of the scheme continuing for MN R/Os only. 

The scheme was introduced immediately post-WWII, partially as the War Office had worries over a lack of skilled operators in the run-up to the Cold War. There were various proposals to raise the test speed for "non-Service" applicants to Service standards, e.g. to 15 or 18 wpm for 30mins and using 5-figure code groups. (==D) That'd cause some dissent amongst the non-Morse brigade!

A memo in the WO file I mentioned in an earlier post looks back over the radio amateur's contribution to the war but it compares the UK "ham" unfavourably with his American counterpart. The GPO restrictions on UK pre-war amateur operation were blamed in part for the lower standards, the memo cites lack of oppurtunity to carry out emergency comms or traffic handling, low-power c/f the USA (150 w here vs 1kW there) and petty restrictions like not being allowed to call CQ, only TEST. 

If your amateur licence in the UK lapses you can usually simply renew it, even decades later, by producing your pass slips or even something as basic as a copy of the Callbook showing the licence details, so issuing a Full Licence to a PMG holder on production of similar bumf and some personal ID shouldn't be too arduous for OFCOM, certainly worth a shot to ask them?

73

G3VKM


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## Larry Bennett

By all accounts the radio amateur licence has been severely devalued over the years, mainly I assume to keep people in the hobby. Before the dropping of the morse requirement, the technical exam had gone from quite a detailed exam to a multi-choice element. Remember when I took mine circa 1976 I had to write a 30 min essay on the use and value of electrolytic capacitors.....

I used to take the morse exam (along with others) at GKA in the early 1980s prior to the RSGB taking over. Can tell many stories of some of the candidates, one of whom threatened to 'fill me in' after I failed him. Another one burst into tears after I passed him, and one candidate took his sending test using some sort of code which bore little resemblance to that devised by Samuel Morse. Seems he was self-taught and learnt his own version!

I am sure some of the GKA guys managed to obtain an exemption on production of their MRGC/PMG but it wasn't that easy to do - think it depended on who you spoke to.

Larry G4HLN +


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## trotterdotpom

A psycho, a girl in a Sparky's body and an Esperanto burbler .... sounds like "One Flew over the Cuckoo's Nest", Larry. Maybe I'll give it a miss.

John T


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## Troppo

ex ro said:


> Now you are spot on there is only test for foundation no other level this gives an M6 prefix, and the ability to operate on all bands with 10 watts max. As an aside last year my local club decided to celebrate the demise of the TItanic by going /MM on a local ferry service to Ireland on which I had served as Radio Officer for 15 years and my last ship was the sister ship to this one on which I served as the seagoing ÉTO they asked me to go as the cw operator the activities would take place in the defunct yet complete radio room using the clubs radio equipment however I would only be allowed to operate in the presence of a full licence holder irrespective of whether he could read or send morse or not needless to say I declined the kind invitation .


What an insult!

******* amateurs!


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## ex ro

Thanks Troppo if it wasn't so sad it would be funny could only happen in the Uk lol
73 Alan


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## endure

ex ro said:


> Now you are spot on there is only test for foundation no other level this gives an M6 prefix, and the ability to operate on all bands with 10 watts max. As an aside last year my local club decided to celebrate the demise of the TItanic by going /MM on a local ferry service to Ireland on which I had served as Radio Officer for 15 years and my last ship was the sister ship to this one on which I served as the seagoing ÉTO they asked me to go as the cw operator the activities would take place in the defunct yet complete radio room using the clubs radio equipment however I would only be allowed to operate in the presence of a full licence holder irrespective of whether he could read or send morse or not needless to say I declined the kind invitation .


If your local club had allowed someone without an amateur licence to operate their station without a licensed amateur being present they could have lost their licence. That's the law. No point in blaming the club.


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## ex ro

endure said:


> If your local club had allowed someone without an amateur licence to operate their station without a licensed amateur being present they could have lost their licence. That's the law. No point in blaming the club.


Once again with all due respect to you I am not and never have blamed anyone I am just relating to anyone who might be interested or not whatever the case may be an incident that happened to me last year.


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## endure

ex ro said:


> Once again with all due respect to you I am not and never have blamed anyone I am just relating to anyone who might be interested or not whatever the case may be an incident that happened to me last year.


Sorry - I phrased that badly. I was just trying to point out the possibly serious consequences for the club if Ofcom had found out and decided to get shirty.


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## ex ro

(Thumb)


endure said:


> Sorry - I phrased that badly. I was just trying to point out the possibly serious consequences for the club if Ofcom had found out and decided to get shirty.


No probs endure tks for the reply 73 Alan


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## Troppo

ex ro said:


> Thanks Troppo if it wasn't so sad it would be funny could only happen in the Uk lol
> 73 Alan


Yes, mate....it is really sad. Very sorry to hear it.


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## Troppo

endure said:


> Sorry - I phrased that badly. I was just trying to point out the possibly serious consequences for the club if Ofcom had found out and decided to get shirty.


I would have told Ofcom to **** right off.

(Cloud)

A truly appalling situation....


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## endure

Troppo said:


> I would have told Ofcom to **** right off.
> 
> (Cloud)
> 
> A truly appalling situation....


As you (presumably) don't have an amateur licence you wouldn't have to suffer any of the consequences of your action. The club may well have to.


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## Troppo

I have held an amateur licence for 35 years...

There was hardly going to be an ofcom inspector on the ferry, was there?

FFS, this is like something out of Monty Python!

Telling an ex Radio Officer that he could not operate CW from the radio room of the very ship he sailed on, unless he was "supervised" by an amateur - who couldn't read CW!


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## King Ratt

Sad that such a situation arises because of rules but EXRO did what I would have done.


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## Troppo

The whole thing is sad and pathetic.

How soon they forget us, eh?

If we let them....


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## lagerstedt

*NZ morse test for Ham Radio Licence*

When I went for my Ham Licence in the early eighties there were 3 grades - grade three - no morse and restricted bands - grade two morse test -I think it was 10 or 12 words per min and usage of all most bands and grade one - 15 words per min and usage of all bands. Now days no morse is required for a licence. My callsigns were ZL2TLA for the grade 3 licence and my current callsign for what is now called a general licence (was grade one) is ZL2BFO.

Regrds
Blair Lagerstedt
NZ
ZL2BFO


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## Andy

Anyone thinking of doing the foundation level in the U.K. should possibly do it now rather than later, Ofcom have expressed concern at the number who have not progressed through the licence system and are in the process of changing things. The RSGB have stated their input (with membership revenue in mind!), and the public/stakeholders will be invited to have their say some time this year via the Ofcom site.
Ofcom's ideas are in a pre consultation pdf here
http://licensing.ofcom.org.uk/binar...sing-updates/Amateur_Radio_Licence_Review.pdf

I doubt it will be a big stick approach, but there may be some band restrictions placed upon lower licence classes as an added incentive to progress.... as power restrictions are clearly being abused by many.

A time limit on a foundation callsign is often mentioned, but it's unlikely to be retrospective due to legal challenges which Ofcom doesn't really fancy.

Going back to a previous post about callsigns issues in VP8... they are simply purchased at Stanley post office, so they are of no help in getting a licence anywhere else. Bob VP8LP had to take a U.K. foundation course to operate over here as an M6.

Again, the 'morse appreciation' in the foundation course is not something anyone fails in!

I have to mention, there are practical tests in the foundation and intermediate exams which are laudable...for example, in the intermediate exam you need to construct a small electronic project. Therefore you can (almost) guarantee that any current intermediate or recent full licence holder will have proven to have used a soldering iron, component recognition, use of a scope and a few other basic bits.


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## trotterdotpom

You have to buy an oscilloscope in order to be an radio amateur? The price of those things can be reckoned in Lissajous Figures! Count me out dit dit dit dah dit dah.

John T


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## Andy

trotterdotpom said:


> You have to buy an oscilloscope in order to be an radio amateur? The price of those things can be reckoned in Lissajous Figures! Count me out dit dit dit dah dit dah.
> 
> John T


No.. the practical parts of the exam will be under supervision of the examiners who will have all the needed equipment.

Exam fee, plus maybe local club cost for a weekend 'course' to pass foundation licence is usually around £40-50.


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## Troppo

Gee, the UK gives FL holders access to all bands...no one wants to upgrade...and people are running more than 10w

I'm shocked!

Shocked!

(Jester)


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## GW3OQK

Anyone want the RSGB foundation & intermediate training books? 

I just received them with a WT8Amp key I bought on ebay, unused wrapped in waxed paper. That's the key I got my PMG1 with. 

To avoid being confused with ex-ro I think I'll register with my callsign.
73, Andrew GW3OQK


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## sparks69

Why bother with morse when you can text ?
(Hey - my spell checker underlined the word _morse_ as not recognised)
I must be getting old


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## Searcher2004

sparks69 said:


> Why bother with morse when you can text ?
> (Hey - my spell checker underlined the word _morse_ as not recognised)
> I must be getting old


Because Morse is faster? See:-

http://www.k3roj.com/morsecode.html and click on the picture of the guy in the telegraphist's hat.

'610


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## Rick R

Another ham here, M1ENZ. Occasionally go 14300 when onboard ship with the older Sailor/Furuno sets that can be unlocked to transmit in amateur bands, the newer kit seems to be locked without an option. Also have an Yeasu FT-60R.


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## Andy

Rick R said:


> Another ham here, M1ENZ. Occasionally go 14300 when onboard ship with the older Sailor/Furuno sets that can be unlocked to transmit in amateur bands, the newer kit seems to be locked without an option. Also have an Yeasu FT-60R.


Welcome aboard Ricky. I'll remember the call... not too dificult as not many M1's around, other than M1ENE who I know. 
I spoke to an /MM in the Java sea on thursday on 15m, M0HJO/MM aboard HMS Echo returning from the search for MH370.

Regards,
Andy


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## trotterdotpom

Interesting that they permit radio amateurs to operate from Royal Navy ships. Sounds like a security issue to me.

John T


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## Andy

trotterdotpom said:


> Sounds like a security issue to me.
> 
> John T


Maybe to you (Thumb)
Heard plenty of USAF /AM and USN /MM on the amateur bands before, the U.S. are more than happy with it, guess the same applies to the RN, obviously with the normal constraints on what is transmitted.


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## Troppo

trotterdotpom said:


> Interesting that they permit radio amateurs to operate from Royal Navy ships. Sounds like a security issue to me.
> 
> John T


She is a survey ship, not a warrie.

The RN (and the RAN) does not normally permit AR from their ships - well, they didn't 5 years ago...


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## Andy

Troppo said:


> The RN (and the RAN) does not normally permit AR from their ships - well, they didn't 5 years ago...


If that is the case, then I'd hazzard a guess that this was done in an educational context, as he has an audience of crew members with him. With his position and experience, 30 years, maintaining comms equipment, and laterly instruction, it is inconceivable that he didn't have full clearance.


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## Troppo

Yes, but it is a survey ship, not a warship, per se.

They may have relaxed rules for "Auxiliaries"


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## hawkey01

Here is another ship-board amateur on the RRS James Clark Ross. Attached link to his web pages. He will be QRT until September now as he will be on leave. All info on the web site.

http://www.gm0hcq.com/jcr_update.htm

Neville - Hawkey01


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## GW3OQK

There will be more CW (and AM) on the band Friday 6th June using WW2 vintage gear commemorating D-Day. See VMARS news page. I will have warmed up the T1154, R1155, CR100 and WT8Amp key. Reports of my chirp, drift and quality of sending appreciated, as would meeting some of you on air. Those T1154 knobs always remind me of the Oceanspan. 73
Andrew


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## Searcher2004

GW3OQK said:


> There will be more CW (and AM) on the band Friday 6th June using WW2 vintage gear commemorating D-Day. See VMARS news page. I will have warmed up the T1154, R1155, CR100 and WT8Amp key. Reports of my chirp, drift and quality of sending appreciated, as would meeting some of you on air. Those T1154 knobs always remind me of the Oceanspan. 73
> Andrew


(For some reason, my first reply to this didn't appear). 

Andrew, 

I hope to be on for the D-Day net, too. Looking to get on 5317 kc AM in the afternoon but game for a CW sked on 3575 or 5260 earlier if you want a report on your kit. I'll most likely be using a US Navy TCS station. 

73
Roger/G3VKM


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## Mayday

Troppo said:


> Ofcom are the most amateurish regulators I have had the misfortune to encounter.
> 
> And I say that as an ex regulator myself.
> 
> To not accept a marine ticket for complete exemption to an amateur licence is scandalous.
> 
> But, having dealt with the professionals (ha!) in Ofcom, I am not surprised...


I got a full exemption in 1978.
I took the path of getting a full exemption in Australia by asking a friend for the use of her address and was given a VK2 after producing my MRGC.
On returning to UK I applied for a UK C/S and was told I needed a morse test. I sent a photocopy of my MRGC and was given G4HOK by return post with no problem.
Those were better days though.

John.


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## Troppo

Well done.


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