# Pretoria Castle



## rknibbs (Mar 11, 2006)

Having just acquired a model of Union Castle's Pretoria Castle I was wondering what her normal ports of call were and what was her UK home port.


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## Chris Isaac (Jul 29, 2006)

Based in Southampton she was one of the Union Castle fleet of passenger mail ships (7) in all, running to South Africa.
She would leave Southampton on a Friday at precisely 1300 bound for Las Palmas for bunkers. Then on to Cape Town where she would arrive just over 11 days after leaving Southampton. Then on to Port Elizabeth, East London and Durban. Turn round and come back via the same route.
Sometimes it varied a bit, stopping at Tenerife instead of Las Palmas and sometimes including Madeira as well.
The whole round trip took 5 weeks, 2 days, 17 hours and 42 minutes.
In the late 1960s she was transferred to Safmarine, although still manned by Union Castle, and was renamed S A Oranje.
Her timetable did change over the years, initially running slower and in later years slower again to save fuel.


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## rknibbs (Mar 11, 2006)

Many thanks Chris just the info I was interested in.


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## 12548 (Mar 23, 2007)

As stated by Chris,quite correct but there were different Schedules for different years,here is a rundown of various Yeras for Pretoria and others.

Sailings October 1957-October 1958 (issued October 1957) 
Vessel(s) Ports of call 
Arundel Castle
Athlone Castle
Capetown Castle
Carnarvon Castle
Edinburgh Castle
Pretoria Castle
Stirling Castle
Winchester Castle Royal Mail Service:
Southampton, Madeira or Las Palmas, Cape Town, Port Elizabeth, East London, Durban. 
Arundel Castle, Carnarvon Castle, Stirling Castle and Winchester Castle called at Madeira southbound and Las Palmas northbound; Athlone Castle, Capetown Castle, Edinburgh Castle and Pretoria Castle in reverse order.
The last 4 vessels also called at Mossel Bay northbound. 

Sailings March 1960-March 1961 (issued March 1960) 
Vessel(s) Ports of call 
Athlone Castle
Capetown Castle
Carnarvon Castle
Edinburgh Castle
Pendennis Castle
Pretoria Castle
Stirling Castle
Winchester Castle (incl. last sailing August/September 1960)
Windsor Castle (incl. maiden voyage August 18, 1960) Royal Mail Service:
Southampton, Madeira or Las Palmas, Cape Town, Port Elizabeth, East London, Durban. 
Athlone Castle, Capetown Castle, Edinburgh Castle and Pretoria Castle called at Las Palmas southbound and Madeira northbound; Carnarvon Castle, Pendennis Castle, Stirling Castle and Winchester Castle in reverse order.
The last 4 vessels also called at Mossel Bay northbound.
From August 1960:
Edinburgh Castle, Pendennis Castle, Pretoria Castle and Windsor Castle called at Las Palmas southbound and Madeira northbound; Athlone Castle, Capetown Castle, Carnarvon Castle and Stirling Castle in reverse order.
The last 4 vessels also called at Mossel Bay northbound.

Sailings February 1962-January 1963 (issued March 1962) 
Vessel(s) Ports of call 
Athlone Castle
Capetown Castle
Carnarvon Castle (incl. last sailing April-June 1962)
Edinburgh Castle
Pendennis Castle
Pretoria Castle
Stirling Castle
Transvaal Castle (from May 1962)
Windsor Castle Royal Mail Service:
Southampton, Madeira or Las Palmas, Cape Town, Port Elizabeth, East London, Durban. 
Athlone Castle, Capetown Castle, Edinburgh Castle and Pretoria Castle called at Las Palmas southbound and Madeira northbound; Carnarvon Castle, Pendennis Castle, Stirling Castle and Winchester Castle in reverse order.
The last 4 vessels also called at Mossel Bay northbound.
From August 1960:
Edinburgh Castle, Pendennis Castle, Pretoria Castle and Windsor Castle called at Las Palmas southbound and Madeira northbound; Athlone Castle, Capetown Castle, Carnarvon Castle and Stirling Castle in reverse order.
The last 4 vessels also called at Mossel Bay northbound.

Sorry if its a bit long and hope it may assist.
joller6


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## rknibbs (Mar 11, 2006)

Really appreciate the extra info - all adds to the story of the model, many thanks.


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## Cisco (Jan 29, 2007)

rknibbs said:


> Having just acquired a model of Union Castle's Pretoria Castle I was wondering what her normal ports of call were and what was her UK home port.


Is she a pre 1956 model... brown masts and derricks... or post 1956 ...white masts and derricks?

If she is post 1956 is she 56/65 ... still with foremast and mainmast ... or post 1965.... stump foremast and signal mast?


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## rknibbs (Mar 11, 2006)

Post 56 still with foremast and mainmast so 56/65 .....


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## 12548 (Mar 23, 2007)

Some info on the old Pretoria Castle Built 1939 then became Warwick Castle which i served on 2 trips mid 1950,s

As Warwick she sailed


Warwick Castle Around Africa service - out West Coast:
London, Rotterdam, Las Palmas, Ascension (every other voyage), St. Helena (every other voyage), Cape Town, Port Elizabeth, East London, Durban, Lourenço Marques (most voyages), Beira, Dar es Salaam, Zanzibar, Tanga, Mombasa, Aden, Port Sudan, Suez, Port Said, Genoa, Marseilles, Gibraltar, London. 

http://www.timetableimages.com/maritime/images/ucldurb.htm

See Pics
Cheers
joller6


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## sailingday (Jun 6, 2007)

Am I mistaken, I seem to remember the castle boats left Southampton at 4 every thursday, perhaps my memory is playing tricks.


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## frankie dee (Feb 24, 2007)

rknibbs said:


> Having just acquired a model of Union Castle's Pretoria Castle I was wondering what her normal ports of call were and what was her UK home port.


I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW WERE ONE CAN OBTAIN MODELS SUCH AS YOUR PRETORIA CASTLE. I SAILED ON HER WHEN SHE WAS THE S A ORANJE. MY EMAIL IS 
(Please use the Private Message system for initial contact. This is a public site and putting up your email address could lead to a lot of spam)


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## nobby s (Jun 25, 2007)

Sailingday, your memory is certainly not playing tricks. As a Southampton man and ex: Union Castle, I can vouch that U/C ships departed from Southampton every Thursday at 16.00 hrs.


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## RGascoyne (Jul 29, 2006)

Chris quoted the sailing time from Southampton after July 1965 when they started a new, faster schedule. Before that they sailed precisely at 4pm every Thursday.


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## canberra97 (Feb 21, 2006)

RGascoyne said:


> Chris quoted the sailing time from Southampton after July 1965 when they started a new, faster schedule. Before that they sailed precisely at 4pm every Thursday.


It changed to a Friday 13.00 sailing at some point, not sure when but can remember it well as a child as my father worked in the port at the time and I would often go down to the docks and witness a Union Castle departure.

I can remember going aboard the old Pretoria Castle the day she left Southampton for the last time in 1975, I was 10 years old, my father had worked on her briefly as the Pretoria Castle in the late 50s as a pantryman so he had fond memories of her.


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## Chris Isaac (Jul 29, 2006)

The precise time of departure was a matter of great pride to us. Chief Officer forward and 2nd Officer aft all singled up and waiting for the bridge to blow the whistle at precisely 1300 on Friday (timed on the chronometer). Then let go fore and aft and we were off!
Very seldom were we late and sometimes dockers and office staff were disembarked via the tugs when out in Southampton Water. 
The mail must get through!!!!


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## BillH (Oct 10, 2007)

canberra97 said:


> It changed to a Friday 13.00 sailing at some point, not sure when but can remember it well as a child as my father worked in the port at the time and I would often go down to the docks and witness a Union Castle departure.
> 
> I can remember going aboard the old Pretoria Castle the day she left Southampton for the last time in 1975, I was 10 years old, my father had worked on her briefly as the Pretoria Castle in the late 50s as a pantryman so he had fond memories of her.


PRETORIA CASTLE 
O.N. 181944. 28,625g. 16,144n. 15,890d. 717.4 x 84.0 x 43.8 feet.
Six steam turbines made by the shipbuilder, driving twin propeller shafts. 35,000 SHP. 22 kts.
17.8.1947: Launched by Harland and Wolff Ltd., Belfast (Yard No. 1332), for Union-Castle Mail Steam Ship Company Ltd. 10.7.1948: Completed.1962: Refurbished by her builders and fitted with air conditioning. 1964: Cayzer, Irvine & Company Ltd., became managers. 1.1.1966: Sold to the South African Marine Corporation (U.K.) Ltd., London. 2.2.1966: Renamed S. A. ORANJE. 17.3.1969: Transferred to the South African Marine Corporation Ltd., Cape Town. 10.1975: Departed Durban for demolition. 2.11.1975: Arrived at Kaohsiung for demolition by Chin Tai Steel Enterprises Company Ltd. 24.1.1976: Work commenced.


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## Shipbuilder (Jun 30, 2005)

It is very these days to find scratchbuilt models of any ship these days, the market for kits seems to have dominated the modelmaking scene. I have never seen a kit for PRETORIA CASTLE. You will often find the small 1200'=1" Union-Castle liners on Ebay & they can go for as much as £150 sometimes. They are mass produced & not particularly detailed, but look well enough at a distance.
I sailed in S.A. ORANJE (ex PRETORIA CASTLE) for a year 1969/70. Here is a model of sister ship EDINBURGH CASTLE that I completed in 1997 at 32'=1". No longer in my possession. Although I still build models regularly, I do not accept private commissions, so I am not looking fro business here - just posting for interest.
Bob


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## BillH (Oct 10, 2007)

Shipbuilder said:


> It is very these days to find scratchbuilt models of any ship these days, the market for kits seems to have dominated the modelmaking scene. I have never seen a kit for PRETORIA CASTLE. You will often find the small 1200'=1" Union-Castle liners on Ebay & they can go for as much as £150 sometimes. They are mass produced & not particularly detailed, but look well enough at a distance.
> I sailed in S.A. ORANJE (ex PRETORIA CASTLE) for a year 1969/70. Here is a model of sister ship EDINBURGH CASTLE that I completed in 1997 at 32'=1". No longer in my possession. Although I still build models regularly, I do not accept private commissions, so I am not looking fro business here - just posting for interest.
> Bob


EDINBURGH CASTLE
O.N. 182892. 28,705g. 16,606n. 717.4 x 84.0 x 43.8 feet.
Six steam turbines made by the shipbuilder, driving twin propeller shafts. 35,000 SHP. 22kts.
16.10.1947: Launched by Harland & Wolff Ltd., Belfast, (Yard No. 1333) for Union-Castle Mail Steam Ship Company Ltd. 26.11.1948: Completed. 1964: Cayzer, Irvine & Company Ltd., became managers. 4.6.1976: Arrived at Kaohsiung for demolition by Chou’s Iron & Steel Company Ltd.


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## Castle (Oct 18, 2016)

Hi Folks,

Sorry I'm late coming to this thread but have only just joined.

I was on the Pretoria Castle 1962-64. Most of the sailing information above is correct (sailing 4 p.m. Thursdays) but has omitted ports of call. 

Southbound:-
Southampton, Las Palmas, *Walvis Bay*, Cape Town, Port Elizabeth, East London, Durban.
Northbound:-
Durban, East London, Port Elizabeth, Cape Town, *Saint Helena, Ascension Island,* Madeira, Southampton.

I've still got my Seaman's book from those days!

A few memories of those days still remain quite clear. I can still picture in my mind my second day on board (still in Southampton) when they had the Board of Trade fire and emergency drill and inspection. I hadn't the faintest idea where anything was on the ship and the inspector singled me out, in front of everyone at my station, for questioning. I couldn't answer any of his questions and things were looking grim. Fortunately the Chief Purser turned up then and explained that I had only just arrived and was still not allowed anywhere without being escorted.


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## Old Se Dog (May 21, 2015)

*sailing times for union castle ships*

hello - i came across some interesting comments regarding the sailing times of union castle mail ships - their were 2 books written on the subject - by the same author - henry damant - both in my collection - but the contents are almost word for word the same - pictures attached - as far as i know the sailing time was changed at one point - as i have read in other union castle books - my 2 favorite being - union castle chronicles - and the union castle line - the later 2 for me the best on the subject of the union castle history regards and respects to all postings


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## harry t. (Oct 25, 2008)

https://youtu.be/JC2qQuZY0bY - Launch of Pretoria Castle

https://youtu.be/9THipMNd9HM - Maiden Voyage


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## Patsytish (Aug 23, 2020)

rknibbs said:


> Having just acquired a model of Union Castle's Pretoria Castle I was wondering what her normal ports of call were and what was her UK home port.


Did Pretoria Castle sail from Southampton to Cape town in July 1962?


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## KZP (Oct 23, 2020)

Pretoria Castle - old postcard


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## old mariner (Aug 8, 2020)

12548 said:


> As stated by Chris,quite correct but there were different Schedules for different years,here is a rundown of various Yeras for Pretoria and others.
> 
> Sailings October 1957-October 1958 (issued October 1957)
> Vessel(s) Ports of call
> ...


thank you for clearing that up


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