# Chased on its anchors?



## malcolmjameswilson (Jun 25, 2017)

Can any Forum member explain to me what the bold text in the following sentence means:

'A sudden and very violent storm had it chased on its anchors and go down the coast on rocky cliffs.'

Is this a reference to the anchor chains breaking?

I greatly appreciate any time taken to answer my question.

Kind regards, Malcolm.


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

Possibly might be similar to 'running over your own anchor'. Sudden storm and the vessel is unable to swing around and the vessel runs over her own anchor.... or chasing her own anchors.

Stephen


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## malcolmjameswilson (Jun 25, 2017)

Hello Stephen.

Many thanks for the explanation. I am very grateful to you.

Kind regards, Malcolm.


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## woodend (Nov 23, 2009)

I would tend to agree with SJC though I have never heard the expressioin before nor experienced the conditions at anchor. 
Have had to run before a gale with an empty tanker that had lost its propeller in tow and she was making efforts to overtake.


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## malcolmjameswilson (Jun 25, 2017)

Hello Woodend.

Many thanks for the confirmation.

Kind regards, Malcolm.


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

FOUNDATION JOSEPHINE and LEICESTER caught in a hurricane at Murray's Anchorage, Bermuda. The LEICESTER was dead ship. JOSEPHINE lashed alongside the LEICESTER and the ship was moored to the Admiralty Buoy, engines at full ahead. The eye passed over and before the tug and ship could swing they came over the mooring and it fetched between the two ships. A real mess! The ships parted, well, the moorings parted, and both ended up ashore.


My own experience. On the Scheldt. Engine went full astern and could not stop. Dropped BOTH anchors and tried to hold on. Slowed the ship but only stopped when the stern.... and the rudder, went into the bank. The engine then went full ahead and we could not recover the anchors fast enough but we certainly 'chased our own anchors'. Thankfully managed to stop the engine and two tugs took the wild beast in tow. Only damage, one bent spade rudder... like a banana. 6 weeks to repair.


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## malcolmjameswilson (Jun 25, 2017)

Hello Stephen.

Now I understand how the ship I am researching came to be lost! Much more serious event than I imagined.

Kind regards, Malcolm.


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## stein (Nov 4, 2006)

Slightly relevant: when caught on a lee shore, unable to come round by wind in the sails alone, the sailing ship manuals advised letting go the lee anchor and bringing her round partly swivelling on that, cutting the cable as she paid off. It was called "club-hauling," and Alan Villiers doubted the manuevre was ever performed. Be that as it may, within my imagination it might be called "chasing one's anchor."


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## makko (Jul 20, 2006)

From the foggy depths of my memory, just another clarification (although I am an Engineer and stand to be corrected!). Under normal cir***stances. it is not the anchor that holds the vessel, it is the length of chain lying on the seabed. That is, the anchor "anchors" the chain, forming the centre of the swinging circle and the friction of the chain on the seabed acts as a brake. I believe the expression is "laying down" the cable. I remember that when we went to anchor, the pick would be dropped and then the vessel put astern to deliver the correct length. If the vessel ran over it's anchor, the friction effect would therefore be lost and would drag its anchor.

The same effect is used in a sea anchor which swings a boat inline with the weather, bettering its chances to ride out the storm. Without the sea anchor, the boat would turn beam on to the waves and run the risk of rolling over or "turning turtle".

The only time you would turn beam on is to create a lee in order to pick up survivors in the water.

Rgds.
Dave


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## stein (Nov 4, 2006)

It is not that long ago in seafaring history that the anchor cable was made of hemp, and perhaps it then even floated? Anyway, in case you are commenting my posting, it was about a maneuvre to get the wind on the other side of the sails when space was lacking to wear by sails alone. A simpler version, demonstrating the core of the system, is for river vessels to fasten a rope ashore in a tight bend and swing around that. But Liardet in his "Points of Seamanship" suggests the method couldbe used by steamers as well, when in a narrow channel or on a lee shore, and due to their great length cannot otherwise be brought around. And unlike when doing this in a sailing ship, a steamer's anchor might even be saved when she has gotten her head to the wind.
Whether this has any relation to the question asked is highly doubtfull, and your point about the heavy cable is accepted.


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## makko (Jul 20, 2006)

Hi Stein,

Nice to chat again! No, I was not questioning anything in your reply, merely to recall what I was told when I was at sea, namely it is the length/weight of the chain that "holds" the vessel in position.

I enjoy your knowledgable postings about sailing vessels: My father has a wonderful book from about the 1870's, a reference book for officers which while it is mostly wooden sailing vessels, also talks about the new fangled iron boats and, Lord forbid!, the state of the art boilers, steam engines and retractable propellors!

In that book, one section that fascinated me was how to patch a wooden hull when the vessel has gone onto rocks and how to refloat the vessel. 

Best Regards,
Dave


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## Bill Morrison (May 25, 2013)

I have a little book on sailing under square sail. No mention of chased on it's anchors.
Stein's post #8 Club-Hauling is given as in attachments.


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

Club Hauling is covered in also Harland's 'Seamanship in the Age of Sail'. 

In days with the 'cable' was hemp, as Stein points out, and floated. In later years in the days of iron vessels chain cable might have been 'chased the anchor'.

Stephen


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## Michael Taylor (Aug 31, 2008)

As I can see our half scale Whaling Vessel, the Lagoda, has a chain attached to its anchor. Once at sea they were removed from the Catheads and stowed on deck. I shall check with some logbooks and report if I find the use of rope.


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

Chain stud link goes way back and first used by the RN in 1818. 

Did smaller vessels use chain? No idea! Definitely for larger type, clippers etc.. for sure. Catting the anchors and stowed on deck as 'normal'. Even large steamers still stowed anchors on deck. See Cunard's CAMPANIA. I guess that depends on the anchors... stocked or stockless.


LAGODA... she used chain. If you are 'club hauling' how do you 'cut' the cable? On a lee shore and in trouble it would be a bigger problem to cut the cable!


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## Michael Taylor (Aug 31, 2008)

Stephen J. Card said:


> Chain stud link goes way back and first used by the RN in 1818.
> 
> Did smaller vessels use chain? No idea! Definitely for larger type, clippers etc.. for sure. Catting the anchors and stowed on deck as 'normal'. Even large steamers still stowed anchors on deck. See Cunard's CAMPANIA. I guess that depends on the anchors... stocked or stockless.
> 
> ...


Yes Stephen, there are many logbook references to "cutting" in our Museum and I have not received a sensible answer (they avoid the question) from our staff experts....will continue work on it.


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

As in 'cut and run' when 'club-hauling 'cutting out'

1. Nautical terms that have become a part of everyday English. ... Other sources indicate "Cut and Run" meant to cut the anchor cable and sail off without delay. 


'Cutting out'.... read some Hornblower books. ;-)
2. Naval boarding is to come up against, or alongside, an enemy ship to attack by placing men ... A cutting out boarding is an attack by small boats, preferably at night and .....


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## stein (Nov 4, 2006)

How about a little French? Falconer's dictionary for 1815 has the following entry for the term "the anchor comes home." (*Le vaisseau chasse sur son ancre, Fr.*) implies that the anchor is dislodged from its bed in the ground by the violence of the wind, sea or current, or all united.

In a summer night in 67 I was doing night watch in Kristiansand. That meant checking the moorings, barring entrance to strangers, and little else. So I spent most of my time reading London's "A son of the Sun," which I found a copy of in the mess room. That is now long ago, but I rember the highlight of that book well, which was simply trying to stay put, hanging on the anchors. Not much technicalities, but more than I expected, and I found being at sea quite romantic then. (This merely to try to put some meat on a single French verb.) 

In Paasch's Dictionaire de Marine, five language edition 1908, the french term chasser is translated as to drive. To drive a bolt. To drive a pile.To drive ashore. The more ordinary translation is of course to chase, pursue, hunt etc.


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## stein (Nov 4, 2006)

makko said:


> Hi Stein,
> ... My father has a wonderful book from about the 1870's, a reference book for officers which while it is mostly wooden sailing vessels, also talks about the new fangled iron boats and, Lord forbid!, the state of the art boilers, steam engines and retractable propellors!
> 
> In that book, one section that fascinated me was how to patch a wooden hull when the vessel has gone onto rocks and how to refloat the vessel.
> ...


I collected seaman's manuals once, paid what for me was large sums for some obscure works in that field. But, to those interested mainly in pure information, John Harland's "Seamanship in the Age of Sail", published by Conway, and beautifully illustrated by Mark Myers, covers nearly all of it (as far as sailing ships goes). Harland has published with Jean Boudriot's publishing company - those works are expensive andf hard to come by, but the Conway work is obtainable at ordinary used book prices. And above in this thread you will find Stephen Card referring to it, and with his time at sea and behind an easel - you have a trustworthy witness to its value.


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## John Jarman (Sep 17, 2009)

stein said:


> I collected seaman's manuals once, paid what for me was large sums for some obscure works in that field. But, to those interested mainly in pure information, John Harland's "Seamanship in the Age of Sail", published by Conway, and beautifully illustrated by Mark Myers, covers nearly all of it (as far as sailing ships goes). Harland has published with Jean Boudriot's publishing company - those works are expensive andf hard to come by, but the Conway work is obtainable at ordinary used book prices. And above in this thread you will find Stephen Card referring to it, and with his time at sea and behind an easel - you have a trustworthy witness to its value.


Hi Stein, great to see you writing on site. Interesting as always.

JJ.


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## 5036 (Jan 23, 2006)

makko said:


> From the foggy depths of my memory, just another clarification (although I am an Engineer and stand to be corrected!). Under normal cir***stances. it is not the anchor that holds the vessel, it is the length of chain lying on the seabed. That is, the anchor "anchors" the chain, forming the centre of the swinging circle and the friction of the chain on the seabed acts as a brake. I believe the expression is "laying down" the cable. I remember that when we went to anchor, the pick would be dropped and then the vessel put astern to deliver the correct length. If the vessel ran over it's anchor, the friction effect would therefore be lost and would drag its anchor.
> 
> The same effect is used in a sea anchor which swings a boat inline with the weather, bettering its chances to ride out the storm. Without the sea anchor, the boat would turn beam on to the waves and run the risk of rolling over or "turning turtle".
> 
> ...


Many drilling rigs have "permanent chasers" instead of anchor buoys. These are like horse collars and were stowed at the anchor winch. They were handed to the Anchor Handling Tug and supported the anchor on the lay and were returned to the rig stowage upon completion. As the anchor was hauled out, 1500m in the northern North Sea, the cable cheese wired its way into the seabed and when the mud settled around the chain, it provided the primary hold. On anchor recovery, they were once again handed to the AHT which ran the length of the chain to the anchor fluidising the mud around the chain making recovery easier. Often chains had to be stretched by the AHT to break them free of the mud.

We also had "chasing hooks" which when dragged on the seabed would tend to plough and the were used to find chain that had broken, or to catch the chain close to a rig when the anchor pennant buoy had disappeared or broken free. They were also used by a secondary AHT to support a chain crossing a pipeline or other structure on the seabed. They are also used to support a catenary reducing hauling loads when laying long chains in deep water.

Is the derivation of the word "chasing" relevant to the original question?


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

Very interesting stuff!

'Chasing' the original question? Well, we might get the answer sooner or later. ;-)


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## Bill Morrison (May 25, 2013)

Nav. #21 . Anchor handling of drilling rigs could be a nightmare if thing did not go as planned. 
I posted some photos on S.N. Gallery some time back taken on an anchor job, can't remember under which section. If interested you will find them my personal photos, I don't post much so easy to find.


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## 5036 (Jan 23, 2006)

Bill Morrison said:


> Nav. #21 . Anchor handling of drilling rigs could be a nightmare if thing did not go as planned.
> I posted some photos on S.N. Gallery some time back taken on an anchor job, can't remember under which section. If interested you will find them my personal photos, I don't post much so easy to find.


I remember Seaforth Conqueror well, we used her on a good few rigmoves. The anchor mid deck is a Bruce, (15 tonne?) which were often difficult to get out the mud, hence the heavy retrieving chain. The port side anchor looks like a Delta Flipper which often had to be piggy backed to allow 100 kip test tensions to be achieved which were done before the chains had time to be gripped by the resettled clays.
Your pictures of C&W Adventurer brings back memories. I know Jock Wishart who put the whole thing together and Bill Mackay who was on the bridge, one of Scotland's best ever racing yachtsmen. Jock still puts things like this together for charity including a rugby game up at the north pole that is in the Guineas Book of Records.


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## Tony Foot (Sep 25, 2012)

I remember from my offshore Oil Industry years (30 of them) The "horse collars".
Properly called anchor chasers, as posted by Nav. He described their operation.
I also question that old saw about the chain actually doing the holding, not the anchor itself.
On an oil rig if the anchor parted from the chain, and especially a wire, the rig could not get enough 'hold' and could easily pull back the chain. With the anchor attached it could not pull back the chain and anchor. The AHT had to lift the anchor before the rig could pull in the chain, anchor and AHT as a unit. 
Ergo it seems to me that the chain does not do the bulk of the holding - the anchor does


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## howardang (Aug 3, 2008)

I remember chasing rig anchors in the 70's. There were various designs of chaser: the "horse collar" type which was handed to the anchor handler by the rig, and also a variety of hook shaped chasers - we knew them as "J" chasers - sometimes used in conjunction with a grapnel.

Here is a link which shows a few different designs.

http://www.intermoor.com/services-5...mooring-equipment-13/grapnels-and-chasers-154


Howard


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## Barrie Youde (May 29, 2006)

#9 and subsequently.

Would anybody suggest that a cable without an anchor would be effective in anything other than conditions of no wind and no current? Plainly not. Thus, I also doubt the theory that the anchor merely holds the cable in place. It seems obvious that the anchor is a vital element (as is the cable) of the entire ground tackle, sine qua non.

Similarly, club-hauling off a lee shore. I too have a copy of Todd & Whall's Practical Seamanship (1898) for use in the Merchant Service, previously owned by Captain Charles Louis Albert Lecoustre, Chief Examiner of Masters and Mates at Liverpool. With all due respect to our forefathers, I've yet to read any account of any club-haul having been executed successfully. Given that the cir***stances where such an exercise might have been called for were quite plainly of an emergency nature, the time necessary for the preparations required seems highly likely to exceed any time available: today or at any time in history.

Is there any authenticated account of a successful club-haul?


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

Seamanship in the Age of Sail -Harland pgs 195 - 197

It is covered and is said to have been happened. He notes that Clubhauling "would have only been succeeded with an extreme well trained and the disciplined ship's company, and with the addition of equal parts of good timing, seamanship and luck!" It was to have happened in HM ship MAGNIFICENT, 74 guns, Basque Roads, 1814. 

Stephen


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## Barrie Youde (May 29, 2006)

Many thanks, Stephen!


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## 5036 (Jan 23, 2006)

Tony Foot said:


> I remember from my offshore Oil Industry years (30 of them) The "horse collars".
> Properly called anchor chasers, as posted by Nav. He described their operation.
> I also question that old saw about the chain actually doing the holding, not the anchor itself.
> On an oil rig if the anchor parted from the chain, and especially a wire, the rig could not get enough 'hold' and could easily pull back the chain. With the anchor attached it could not pull back the chain and anchor. The AHT had to lift the anchor before the rig could pull in the chain, anchor and AHT as a unit.
> Ergo it seems to me that the chain does not do the bulk of the holding - the anchor does


Tony, Barry,
Re-reading my original post, I should have said "some areas of the North Sea" and in those areas pulling anchors was problematic and the AHT often had to pull hard to break a chain out. A permanent chaser system helped breakouts by reducing the friction. Pulling anchors with winches generated a much greater force than the force experienced during normal mooring operations and was generally sufficient to break an anchor chain out once the AHT had lifted and stretched the anchor cable. After laying a spread and prior to leaving the installation testing would bring opposing anchor pairs up to 150kips (68 te) whilst the operating force was, from memory, generally around 50kips (22 te).

There were other areas of the North Sea, the Central North sea where poor holding ground required one and sometimes two piggy back anchors to achieve the required holding and in such cases it is obvious that, initially, the chain purely connected the anchor to the installation.

Also bear in mind after laying an anchor and prior to tensioning, it would be left to "soak" for six hours to allow the sand/silt/clay/mud to settle around the anchor to achieve the best holding power, it was the same effect on the chain.

The holding power of the chain can be easily calculated. For 3" anchor chain, the holding power from the chain is Pc= f*Lc*Wc where f is the friction coefficient (0.95 for sand, 1.25 for clay), Lc is the length of chain on the seabed and Wc is the weight of chain in seawater(117kg/m for 3" chain). Our spreads from memory were 1000m and assuming 800m on the seabed that gave 0.95*800*117/1000 te = 89te for sand and 117 te for clay.


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## makko (Jul 20, 2006)

Thanks for that Nav! I am an engineer but I always took interest in all departments. Nice to know some of the grey cells still work!
Rgds.
Dave


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## Barrie Youde (May 29, 2006)

#30 

Many thanks, Nav.

All noted!

With or without the scientific formula which you provide, it is clear that the weight of the cable used is (with the anchor) an integral part of the ground tackle. Otherwise, simply to put the hook on the sea bed should be enough, which is plainly not the case in most instances.


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## Tony Foot (Sep 25, 2012)

That is true, up to a point.
Some rigs used wire from the rig to the anchor, but the anchor in this case could still hold the required tension.
If "piggy backing" anchors a wire was used to connect the second anchor to the first, and indeed sometimes to the third.
The chain chaser I understood was used as being safer and quicker than the buoy and pendant method used in the early days.
Again chain chasing was used if the pendant or buoy broke free, usually with a J hook or grapnel.


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## Barrie Youde (May 29, 2006)

Where the object of the exercise is to tether something to mother earth, it seems to me that the inegrity of the entire arrangement is vital, whether it is the tethering of a ship by an anchor (or anchors), a marquee by tent pegs or a horse by a hitching rail. If there is a weakness in any of those factors then the entire arrangement becomes useless. Obviously it is proper to investigate where any weakness might lie, but it seems quite wrong to dismiss a ship's anchor itself as "merely holding the cable in place", when both cable and anchor (and windlass and/or bitts) are all part and parcel of the one arrangement. If any one of those things might be inadeqate then the entire arrangement will fail.


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## 5036 (Jan 23, 2006)

Barrie Youde said:


> Where the object of the exercise is to tether something to mother earth, it seems to me that the inegrity of the entire arrangement is vital, whether it is the tethering of a ship by an anchor (or anchors), a marquee by tent pegs or a horse by a hitching rail. If there is a weakness in any of those factors then the entire arrangement becomes useless. Obviously it is proper to investigate where any weakness might lie, but it seems quite wrong to dismiss a ship's anchor itself as "merely holding the cable in place", when both cable and anchor (and windlass and/or bitts) are all part and parcel of the one arrangement. If any one of those things might be inadeqate then the entire arrangement will fail.


Absolutely right Barry, it would be a brave operator that dependended only upon chain.
There are many factors in mooring chain versus wire. In shallow to medium water chain is more resistant to wear at the touchdown point and gives a dampening effect against sudden forces such as waves. The chain lasts longer and is therefore more cost effective. It is also more easily repaired in situ when a link gives way.
Wire is used in medium to deep water attached to a long section of chain because of its reduced catenary weight and the longer centenary gives a much better motion on-board during rough weather.
Much of the AHT crews art is expressed in the attachment and dettachment of chain and wire when a composite system is used and its danger highlighted by the tragic 2007 Bourbon Dolphin incident after which major changes were implemented.
I never saw wire only in the North Sea or The Far East in anything other than pipelay, crane or bury barges which were always moving or in temporary locations. Rigs had to be more secure to protect their blow out preventer and well head systems.


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## Tony Foot (Sep 25, 2012)

Hi, Nav!
The rig "Big John" had wire only on her anchors and I can think of a semi which had that also. The name eludes me .
Some Jack Ups had wire only but they were only used for positioning the rig initially of course.
Did you never see an anchor part from the chain or a fouled anchor where the rig just sucked the chain back to the rig without any assistance from the AHT?
I do agree that the chain plays a part in the holding but still think the anchor does the bulk of the holding. Especially the specialised oilfield anchors like delta flippers and Bruce anchors. It may be different for the admiralty and Capt Cook type of anchor.
BTW I remember when we launched our first Bruce anchor over the stern, it took about 70% of our deck boards with it. we felt quite naked and embarrassed.


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## chadburn (Jun 2, 2008)

From the Admiralty Manual.
"The anchor lies flat along the bottom until the strain on the cable pulls it along, the tripping palms tilt the flukes and they dig in. After further dragging, the anchor embeds itself in until it holds. The pull of the cable must always be horizontal if the anchor is to maintain its maximum hold.
The cable must be long enough to ensure that a part of it near the anchor always remains on the seabed. The rest of the cable acts as a spring, preventing the anchor from being jerked by any movement of the ship.
The amount of cable put out depends on:
The depth of water.
Type of cable.
Length of stay. 
Weather, and to a certain extent, the nature of the bottom in general.
The length of cable put out is almost always several times the depth of water where the ship anchors"
The above refers to the Type 14 Bower anchor.
Since this was written the world at sea has changed with structures some called "its" who require different methods of securing to the sea bottom.


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## 5036 (Jan 23, 2006)

Tony Foot said:


> Hi, Nav!
> The rig "Big John" had wire only on her anchors and I can think of a semi which had that also. The name eludes me .
> Some Jack Ups had wire only but they were only used for positioning the rig initially of course.
> Did you never see an anchor part from the chain or a fouled anchor where the rig just sucked the chain back to the rig without any assistance from the AHT?
> ...


I did not know of Big John but I recall some of the Flotels had all wire.Certainly did see a few parted anchors but the break was always close to the installation. We had one with the Sedco 700 where we had completed test tensioning the anchors to 150 kips and happy with our work were packing up all the positioning hardware into boxes. The rig suddenly leapt into the air as a chain broke. After completing the test a link had started to "yield", a condition where the metal started to elongate because of a flaw in the link. From this point it only takes a relatively small load to continue elongation until the link breaks. The Wimpey Seafox was recalled and the legend that was Kenny Morrison calmly put everything back together.
We had a towmaster nicknamed "Piggy Back Fred" who always seemed to be landed with dragging anchors and having to put on one, and sometimes two, piggy backs.
I also recall one rig move where we could not pull in anchors with the winches because of chains being stuck in. The rig was over a well head and was therefore restricted in movement. The AHT lifted the anchors and pulled them back to the rig until the chain was short enough to be broken free by the winches, the AHT then stretched the anchor chain out again for recovery. It was the exception rather than the rule.


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## Ian Lawson (Apr 30, 2017)

Succesful anchoring depends on the length of cable on the seabed. Forget aids to memory such as three times depth of water and all that jazz. It is the horizontal pull and weight of chain ON SEABED!


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