# UK submarine hits Red Sea rocks ( BBC )



## Gavin Gait (Aug 14, 2005)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7422774.stm

(EEK) (EEK) (EEK) (EEK)


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## Gavin Gait (Aug 14, 2005)

http://www.shipsnostalgia.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=118437
Daniel's ( Gibdan ) excellent photo of HMS Superb before she hit the rocks....


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## Coastie (Aug 24, 2005)

These rocks, you know, they really are really mischievious things, they jump out at you when you least expect them!!


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## AncientBrit (Oct 6, 2007)

The Old Grey Flu, She aint what she used to be...............
AB


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## John Briggs (Feb 12, 2006)

AMAZING!! According to the BBC - 
"The Navy is now trying to work out how to return the vessel to port. 
It is currently in international waters, but is unable to dive because of the damage to its sonar equipment."

They also report the MoD as saying -
"There were no casualties and the submarine remains watertight, is safe on the surface and able to operate under her own power." 

So why doesn't she return to port? Not the Navy I used to know!


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## Coastie (Aug 24, 2005)

Probabaly some elfin safety issues which need to be addressed, like makin' sure their sonar works!!


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## AncientBrit (Oct 6, 2007)

"So why doesn't she return to port? Not the Navy I used to know!"


Sign of the times my friend, the nearest friendly port that can fix her is most likely Devonport. 
Two RN subs hitting the bottom in the past couple of weeks what a poor imitation of the RN I knew. Sadly pathetic is what it is.
AB


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## UmbornePirate (Feb 3, 2007)

*Was the rock charted?*

Before leaping to too many unsupported conclusions it might be worth asking whether the rock pinnacle was charted. The loss of the Ennerdale in the Seychelles comes to mind, she was the first to discover, the hard way, that a rock pinnacle existed.

Can anyone with access to the latest Red Sea chart tell us the date of the survey shown on it?

Pirate


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## portree (Dec 4, 2007)

So they have admitted hitting the bottom, after last time, hitting the Isle of Skye they denied it had happened even after lousing off one of their "SUB SUNK" transponders, weeks later the admitted to an icident! £5m after hitting the basement at 14kts! and a hole in the bow you could get a bus through! WATCH THIS SPACE.

Yoss


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## waimea (Dec 21, 2005)

I don't know that the old navy was any better. There is an Anchorite Rock on the Admiralty Chart of the Hauraki Gulf, Auckland NZ. Named after its discoverer, HM Submarine Anchorite. About 1962 if my memory serves me well. Still, no GPS in those days and that rock was not known about. Risky way to survey though!


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## raybnz (Sep 10, 2005)

I can remember reading about HMS Anchorite saga. It turned out that local fishermen knew of this rock but had not got around to telling the navy.


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## James_C (Feb 17, 2005)

I'm not sure the "Old" Navy is in any way superior to the "new" one.
After all, you just can't get away with incidents (in their varying degrees) today as opposed to the past where as we all know all manner of things used to go on and were kept quiet/ignored.
Many people seem to have selective memories.


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## John N MacDonald (Apr 1, 2008)

You'd think the Navy would have known about the rock in NZ! After all who do the surveys for the charts?(EEK)


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## James_C (Feb 17, 2005)

John,
I think the problem with the Kiwi coast in the past was that until fairly recently large chunks of the coast had been last surveyed was by a certain J Cook Esquire of Whitby!


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## Gavin Gait (Aug 14, 2005)

They should have known about the rock they just hit i'd have thought. The RN Hydrographic survey vessels did a "comprehensive" survey of the Red Sea in the 60's/70's and I think more recently too. I can find no excuse for this , with all of the very advanced navigation equipment onboard ( INS - Inertial Navigation System , uses 3 very accurate gyroscopes and a very accurate speed log to do very accurate positioning without needing to come to periscope depth to get a GPS fix , accurate to within 1/3rd of a NM I think ) they should have left plenty of "error" space between the sub and the pinnacle they hit.


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## johnalderman (May 27, 2006)

I think one one two people may have just reached the pinnacle of their career


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## John N MacDonald (Apr 1, 2008)

Re Captain Cook. I read somewhere that the charts of the area of the Great Barrier reef hadn't changed that much since his survey! 
I don't know how much truth there is in that. Maybe you guys Down Under or the folks who have sailed in that area can put me right.


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## surfaceblow (Jan 16, 2008)

I was on a US survey ship in the mid 80's and I would not trust the results. Especially around Somalia. We landed a few shore base crews that camp out and set up antenna's on the beach. The mother ship does lines toward the beach using the information from the shore antenna and the bottom and side scan sonars which the computers record and the large plotters made up a rough paper copy. The Nav Aids on the beach was a co ed bunch and had some alcohol with them. Some time during their stay on the beach the antenna got bent during a football game. Instead or redoing the survey the Powers to be (Navy Personnel on-board) decided to figure out the time that the antenna got bent and the direction of the bend then changed the results on the computer for the soundings.


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## Norm (Jun 21, 2006)

If its true that the "old navy" was better than the "new navy" they must have been very very much better, out of all proportion better, when you consider the larger number of ships they had in those days. Incidents always happen, then and now.

Superb unable to dive...was she about to make the Suez Canal passage submerged...LOL

Come to think of it, I used to have a T-shirt with "Old Navy" on the front.


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## LEEJ (Mar 25, 2006)

This incident, on top of the _Trafalger _ grounding,confirms my impression re HMS _Exeter_ which attracted such nonsense about being PC. To be fair it is not known whether this rock was charted - but Im not holding my breath.
LEEJ


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## spongebob (Dec 11, 2007)

Anchorite rock in Auckland's Hauraki Gulf is now well marked on Admiralty charts and, as I recall, the notation is something like "Broaches at low tide and in heavy seas". 
It is a nasty little pinnicle in a large gulf that is otherwise deep water. In the 1950's the NZ Navy were very active surveying the gulf and coastal waters to the north and south of Auckland with survey ship HMNZS "Lachlan" and attendant vessels to bring Captain Cook's earlier charts and ammendments right up to date but this little finger avoided detection until HMS "Anchorite" came along to claim the honour.

In the seventies I sailed my 22 foot bilge keeler in the rock's area and was always very attentive when sailing by the seat of my pants and only a rough idea of my exact position
It was certainly known to ardent fishermen as a good spot but naturally they did not tell to many people about it


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## callpor (Jan 31, 2007)

Davie Tait said:


> They should have known about the rock they just hit i'd have thought. The RN Hydrographic survey vessels did a "comprehensive" survey of the Red Sea in the 60's/70's and I think more recently too. I can find no excuse for this , with all of the very advanced navigation equipment onboard ( INS - Inertial Navigation System , uses 3 very accurate gyroscopes and a very accurate speed log to do very accurate positioning without needing to come to periscope depth to get a GPS fix , accurate to within 1/3rd of a NM I think ) they should have left plenty of "error" space between the sub and the pinnacle they hit.


Davie, I have some sympathy with the RN navigators on the sub. Although a little rusty on the subject I became very involved with the Hyrodgraphic Office in about 1983/4 following an incident to one of our loaded VLCC's which hit a rock pinnicle in the northern Red Sea entrance to the Gulf of Suez within the 'new' traffic separation lanes which severly punctured the hull through several centre tanks. With the help of the HO it was found that the most recent surveys of that area were made around 1872 using a hand lead-line! Quoting the hydrographic experts at that time - "only one third of the world's continental shelves have been surveyed to modern standards and areas such as the Red Sea and South China Sea and many others, have never been surveyed". This was reinforced by statements from the Hydrographer himself in many of the HO annual reports in the late 1980's and early 1990's. Unless survey funding has increased significantly, I would be surprised whether very much has changed. Chris Allport


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## Gavin Gait (Aug 14, 2005)

Thanks for that Chris thats put this in a totally new light for me , you would have thought that as a major waterway for the worlds shipping someone would have done a proper survey !!!


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## johnny2dogs (May 11, 2008)

im surprised the navy didnt see that rock, the merchant navy lads have been painting their ships names on every rock, since krakatoa erupted. johnny2dogs


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