# When You Were A Young Ro.



## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

When you were a young RO did you look like this?(Jester)

I really should have posted these couple of old photos in the Members faces Gallery but I thought that here would be sufficient and probably get enough ridicule.(EEK)
The first is pretty ordinary except I am sporting one of the many different variations of beards that all the younger members of the officers grew on the long hauls from the US to India and also trans Pacific and other voyages. This is the chin strap variety. They usually started as full sets and the degenerated into all sorts of shapes and cuts. One morning one of us arrived at breakfast with half a beard i.e. one side of the face hairy the other clean shaven. There were as you can imagine many permutations. Fortunately the Capt. Jim Castle, of the Stevies Blanchland, was understanding and never seemed phased by any of the antics. He was then only in his early 30’s and liked a good time. Also it was a tramp ship after all. The other is what a well dressed RO should wear. The smoking jacket was I have to tell you of pure silk and was a fabulous - Black and Red – the hat by Goodness knows and the Parrot - ex African Grey – or was it green. There were both aboard and I can’t remember which it is. This would have been the 3rd Engrs cabin, taking an ale or two.
Note also the fine cigarette case in the top pocket, if memory serves me correctly - Gold – real – and leather. Extremely flash and 007’ish.
Just a little light entertainment for we RO’s(Jester)

Hawkey01(==D)


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## Ron Stringer (Mar 15, 2005)

*Young R/O*

So you are looking for pictures of silly beards?

Try this for size. You can see that I was putting in a full day's hard work alongside in Gladstone Qld.


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Ron,

a truely fine beard. 


Hawkey01


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## Ron Stringer (Mar 15, 2005)

*Beards*

One I made earlier, in Govan.

I had a later beard that came complete with a shaven head but lost the photos during a house move (or, more likely, my wife dumped them - she hated them).


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Ron,

looks like all the others are keeping their heads down - don't want to show how cool they were. Of course on the other hand maybe the photos have been consigned to the bin. Amazing what comes to life when you move. I have a load of letters which I sent to my parents from way back, which I found when clearing their house in Devon and after my Dad passed away. Other things I had for various reasons squirreled away in files. It is all part of our Nostalgia base for this site. I have quite a few letters from companies to whom I applied for a job. All now gone so the letter headers are nostalgic on that basis. Somehow I will posted them eventually, just pure nostalgia. Also the odd contract from a Greek company I was employed by. A PandO employment brochure. All this brings back memories.

Hawkey01


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## Bob Murdoch (Dec 11, 2004)

Hi, 
Union SS Co (NZ) Ltd. "Kaitoa" Melbourne, New Year's morning 1961.
In full Company dress uniform for pre-lunch drinkies.
Bob


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Bob,

excellent.(Applause) A very fine company NZ - I only wish I had realised what a fine uniform they had.(Thumb) I would have joined for that alone. 
I knew I would get an opportunity to upload some of my old memorabilia. Attached this time 1. is a list of uniform braid for NZ and 2. a pay scale for RO's for 1968.

Hawkey01


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## trotterdotpom (Apr 29, 2005)

I imagine those pay rates were monthly - not bad in '68.

I can't imagine anyone surviving 27 years on the Kiwi coast to get the top rate though!

John T.


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## Bob Murdoch (Dec 11, 2004)

Hi Hawkeye
Wrong company mate, Union SS Co (N.Z.) Ltd. Part of the P and O group as well but NZ flagged and running, mainly, between NZ and Aussie. Still, a great company.
I did two and a bit years with them. Went ashore in NZ as a radio inspector a couple of days after my 21st birthday. Seems incredible nowadays that some of us were at sea as radio officers whilst still only 16. Great days indeed.
Cheers Bob


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Bob,

whoops! that will teach me not to read the post correctly.

JT. yes I suppose it was not too bad. However I went with a Greek company that year and starting was 125 month - equivalent to 10 years seniority with NZ. Then got them up to 142. At that time Niarchos were paying around 175. To think 125 is about a weekly shopping bill now - including the odd bottle of course.
By the way have you heard that Brian Priestley - NESWT Association - is desperately ill, unfortunately with no chance of recovery. 

Neville - Hawkey01


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## Troppo (Feb 18, 2010)

Interested to see that NZ R/O's had blue, not green colour behind their braid....never heard of that before....always green.


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## sparkie2182 (May 12, 2007)

A new one to me too Troppo.............


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## trotterdotpom (Apr 29, 2005)

If those letters are from Union Steamship Co, why does it say "New Zealand Shipping Company" on the letter head? I think it is NZ Shipping Co which also amalgamated with Federal Steam Navigation Co. (all British registered ships as far as I know).

New Zealand Shipping Co officers wore epaulettes on their uniforms instead of having rings on their sleeves. I wasn't aware of the light blue background though, maybe someone from the company could enlighten us - where are you now, Graham Turner of Wellington?

John T.


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## Bob Murdoch (Dec 11, 2004)

*yup*

Correct, trotterdotpom, those were the N.Z. Shipping Company which was also part of the P & O group and who were to all intents and purposes the same as Federal, except for ship names and colour schemes. Eventually, about 1966(?) the NZ Shipping names and colours disappeared. 
I was with the Union SS Co (NZ) Ltd but went out to NZ as supernumary on the NZ Co's Hauraki. I am wearing shoulder boards because it was Melbourne on 1st Jan. 1961, middle of Summer so semi-tropical rig. I usually wore what I think was called Red Sea rig, i.e. short sleeved shirt with shoulder boards and blue long trousers. Of course, it was not always such weather! No trousers in photo, wearing a lavalava, popular for sleeping apparel then.
Cheers, Bob


trotterdotpom said:


> If those letters are from Union Steamship Co, why does it say "New Zealand Shipping Company" on the letter head? I think it is NZ Shipping Co which also amalgamated with Federal Steam Navigation Co. (all British registered ships as far as I know).
> 
> New Zealand Shipping Co officers wore epaulettes on their uniforms instead of having rings on their sleeves. I wasn't aware of the light blue background though, maybe someone from the company could enlighten us - where are you now, Graham Turner of Wellington?
> 
> John T.


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

JT.

You are doing the same as me, not reading carfeully enough!. I made the first mistake by reading Bob's reply as NZ and not Union SS. That is why we had a little confusion. Tis an age thing they tell me. 
Some companies did not like to conform with uniforms but for the life of me I cannot think of any others that did not use green. Did PandO not use another colour similar to the Engrs? someone did. 
That allows me now to upload a few more items. See attached this time some pages from a PandO brochure - sent out when you applied for a job giving all the relevant departments. Ships of the fleet at that time - 1968 - Table of who was under who - and the back page - Oronsay.

Hawkey01


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## Treborvfr (Feb 22, 2010)

hawkey01 said:


> Some companies did not like to conform with uniforms but for the life of me I cannot think of any others that did not use green.


BP didn't use colour for the R/Os, it was zig-zag braid on black, with a loop in the top band of braid.

Bob


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## Troppo (Feb 18, 2010)

hawkey01 said:


> JT.
> 
> That alows me now to upload a few more items. See attached this time some pages from a PandO brochure - sent out when you applied for a job giving all the relevant departments. Ships of the fleet at that time - 1968 - Table of who was under who - and the back page - Oronsay.
> 
> Hawkey01


Fascinating, many thanks.

I have long been interested in P and O, GBVC, GVSN, et al.

I remember visiting GBVC for her final Sydney trip - only 3 sparkies left then.

In Australia, we were offered either retraining or a golden handshake. With a young family, I took the pot of gold at the bottom of the gangway.

Did any P and O sparkies retrain as mates?


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

OK, 
found another who did not use the green. How many more I wonder.

Toppo,
Glad you like the nostalgia, it just takes a little nudge to get the brain wandering back over the years. 

Hawkey01


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## Vital Sparks (Sep 19, 2007)

In recognition of the number of men and ships lost during WWII, the British Government granted to the officers of BP and Cunard the privilidge of wearing Royal Naval braid on their uniforms.


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## Ron Stringer (Mar 15, 2005)

Don't think so! Have a look elsewhere on the site and you will see that, in the MN, braid is a matter of choice for a shipping company. They can decide that no uniform is needed and, if they choose to require a uniform, they can decide what braid is used to denote various ranks. In an attempt to avoid every company having its own style of braid, a sort of standard was introduced in (I think) the 1930s but its adoption, or not, is purely a matter of choice for the shipowner.

Some owners chose a different braid to suit their own conceits but no Government (not even the recent ones) would be so crass as to select one or two companies for special commendation concerning their performance in the war. No single company took significantly greater risks, or performed more deserving services, than any other. You might argue that all tanker companies deserved more than meat carriers, or ships that largely sailed unescorted suffered more than those within convoys, but all such claims would be very subjective and open to counter-arguments.

In my view, they all deserved far more and far better recognition than they ever received. And after all, it was the crews that risked their lives and welfare, not the companies - they only hazarded their money. So it would be illogical to ignore the people and reward the organisations, wouldn't it? (Smoke)


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## Bob Murdoch (Dec 11, 2004)

Vital Sparks said:


> In recognition of the number of men and ships lost during WWII, the British Government granted to the officers of BP and Cunard the privilidge of wearing Royal Naval braid on their uniforms.


This has also been claimed for Clan Line, for the same reasons. No slur intended but did Cunard lose so many ships?
Cheers Bob


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## Troppo (Feb 18, 2010)

I have heard that once you were sunk, you were off pay - this certainly applied to the crew, but what about R/O's?


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Well here we have a couple more little bits of paper nostalgia.
First is a bill. Some of us who were living on board during DD decided that we should have a little party - must have been 1965. One of us was into the organisation and phoned the local hospital to ask various local luvverlies to join us for a few bevvies. For some reason they did not seem to kean. I do remember we had a lot of lasses from - I think British Wire ropes - who joined us for our jollities. Why I kept this bill I will never know.
I have made a rough calculation at todays prices. I did not complete it as I got bored, a low boredom level you see. I had by then got to £183.53. Haven't prices risen!!
Also an old MIMCO letter and another one from LOF. 


Hawkey01


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## Ron Stringer (Mar 15, 2005)

Hawkey01,

But around that time we were paying even less from the ship's bond - Gordon's Gin at 5/- a bottle and Bell's Whiskey at 7/6. But beer was 20/- a case, so it was _so-o-o_ much more economical to keep off the beer and stick to spirits. Those were the days.


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Ron,

unfortunately we could not get near the bond as you realise being in DD. Yes, seem to remember a bottle of Whiskey was 10/-. On the Shell Opalia we had a bar and shots of Gin and Whiskey were something like 3d. Mind you the old man (Jimmy Britain) used to check the bar book religiously to make sure no one was drinking too much. If he thought you were over the top a reprimand followed.

Neville - Hawkey01


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## Ron Stringer (Mar 15, 2005)

Neville,

I paid off in Greenwells from the 'San Florentino' in 1964 - no bars aboard then. But there was plenty of booze from the bond (not on the coast of course). Being Shell, usually it was Heineken but occasionally Amstel and rarely, Tuborg. Big shouts of joy from those aboard when once or twice it was Carlsberg. 

It all left me cold since I was never a fan of lager-type beers. Since those were about the only type that travelled well and were drinkable at sea, we had to make do with them. (Jester)

When with Ellermans, we were lumbered with a semi-lager type of beer produced by Charrington's in the East End, called 'Toby Ale'. It is hard to find anything positive to say about that beer and it was most unsuitable for ships without air-conditioning. Not only did it taste foully when warm, not more than about 10% of the contents could be rescued when you opened the can. The rest was sprayed around the bulkheads, deckhead, deck and your shipmates. We understood that Sir John Ellerman was a major shareholder in Charrington's and hence the provision of their product on his ships. Or maybe the chief belly-robber just cut a deal in Tilbury.

Sticking to Gordon's and Bell's avoided all that nonsense.


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Ron,

it must always have been the old man or Chief stewards choice of beer/larger.
On the tramp it was a case of anything that was handy. Remember we arrived into Newark on our first around the worlder on NYK charter - think, they were the ones with the Orange colours. No beer left in the bond so the Capt/ChStwd ordered a load of American beer - no comment - This was supposed to keep us around the coast, a month or so and then back to Japan. No chance it was all gone well before we left the coast. He said that there was absolutely no way the company would allow him to purchase more beer. We had a few cases of Asahai or Kirren which were rationed to 1 or 2 per week for the duration of the run back to Japan. That is one way to dry out!

I sort of went of my point there. On Shell we always seemed to have Tennants larger - good stuff - and the most terrible Watneys Red Barrel which should have had a health warning as it was disgusting.

Tennants always seemed to be the larger of choice. With Orangeboom and the like if we visited the Netherlands. That always gave me a headache - wonder why.

Now days I very rarely drink larger/beer. I am very fond of good wine and also G-AND-T.

Hawkey01


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## trotterdotpom (Apr 29, 2005)

Like many unknowledgable Philistines, in the late '60s I drank Watney's Red Barrell - fortunately it was killed in one fell swoop by a Monty Python skit.

"Oranjeboom" means Orange Tree but it was always "oranje" at night and "BOOM" in the morning!

Recently got red print on the liver section of my blood test print out - sadly reconsidering my options. Well, thinking about it.

John T.


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

JT,

Morning, the Orangeboom did just that to me for sure. The print does not sound too good.
I suppose depends on what the Medics tell you. It will for sure not be what you want to hear. Try some milk thistle, I used to take capsules before taking alcohol, it did work. For some reason given them up. Probably all the other stuff I have to put down the throat - pills that is.
Trying to recover from big sinus op at present - one week into it and getting better very slowly. They forgot to tell me it could take up to 6 weeks. 

Neville


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## trotterdotpom (Apr 29, 2005)

Only just in the red and hoping for a better result next time.

Milk Thistle? Sounds yummy ....

Good luck with the recovery.

John T.


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## Ron Stringer (Mar 15, 2005)

hawkey01 said:


> With Orangeboom and the like if we visited the Netherlands. That always gave me a headache - wonder why.
> 
> 
> > *Oranjeboom* - that's the one! Was trying to recall the name when I was writing my previous post but gave up in the end. Running from Pernis to various NW European and Scandinavian ports for several months in 1963/64, we often took stores in Rotterdam. Always shouts of relief when we saw crates of Heineken coming aboard and cries of ''Oh no! It's bloody Oranjeboom again'' if we were unlucky.


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## G4UMW (May 30, 2007)

hawkeye01 said:


> No beer left in the bond so the Capt/ChStwd ordered a load of American beer - no comment


American beer is like making love in a canoe - they're both f*****g close to water.

I remember Oranjeboom in the stubby green bottles. Another blast from the past was Ind Coope Long Life beer which made a change from the ubiquitous Tennants. Both had a tendency to decorate the deckhead when opened...


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Rob,

especially when some young blood managed to shake it up well. Regarding the American ale. One evening three/four of us were having a pre-going ashore drink and polished off a case of said item. Did not seem to have much effect on we jolly jacks. I hasten to add before I upset any of our American colleagues - that I actually do quite like some of the well known brands. I am sure that when you know the ropes there must be some good stuff hidden away in the country.

JT, You can buy said Thistle in good health food shops. Take a couple before taking the juice and it helps to protect the old liver. So I am told by my Medical Herbalist friend.

Neville - Hawkey01


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## G4UMW (May 30, 2007)

Hi Nevile,

Forget the mass-produced stuff - some of the beers and ales being produced by the smaller American breweries and micro-breweries are excellent.


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Rob,

Knew it had to be the case. We were heading States side this autumn but for reasons we are not going. So I will have to wait awhile longer to try some of the ales.

Neville - Hawkey01


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Malcolm,

Yes I seem to remember having a beer allocation on the Greeks ship - think it was Sunday lunch. Fortunately we had a good cook and most of the grub was pretty fair. I could not take the fish soup for breakfast though. However on the Capts authority he was told that I could have eggs instead! Took me a while to get used to them fried in olive oil. Would not use anything else now but then it was very new to me.
I seem to remember a thread sometime ago about beers of the world - some were without a doubt just plain vile. I did like the Japanese brews. I suppose like most things after the first couple anything is OK.

Neville - Hawkey01


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## Naytikos (Oct 20, 2008)

It is (or was) laid down in Greek maritime law that the entire ship's company must get beer with lunch every Thursday and Sunday. The meals on those two days are the same and are (were) the best meals of the week food-wise.

For a while I (and my wife) developed an aversion to lager-type beers and so used to have 40/50 cases of Double Diamond delivered aboard with the stores. In those days it was available all over the place, even Dubai.
It went into the main store-room with everything else, and I kept a handy pile of 4 or 5 cases in a motor-room or suchlike near to the radio-room.

On one ship, the Chief Steward miscalculated and ran out of beer, so I had the only supply and, of course, was able to ensure we continued to comply with the rules! The cook on that ship was a bit of an alcoholic but wouldn't drink spirits and so used to freeze the cans to increase the concentration.


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## aussiesparks (Nov 11, 2009)

On the Port Vindex on the Aussie coast with the bond closed they got local beer on board,, one was melbourne "Tiger" beer which had on the caase "Guaranteed no after effects",, today they would have been up for misleading advertizing as I certainly woke up worse for wear quite often.
Later on , on the Scorton there was very little to drink but I remember during bunkering in Singapore the girls from the bum boats would come on board and go through all the loose change from around the world you had and swap it for cold Turborg beer,, that was really great.


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Aussiesparks,

what a nice way to get a cold Tuborg. I can almost see it all now. The Scorton was quite large to only have MF. Cannot remember how this odd arrangement came about that some could sail deep sea with only MF. Some odd ball reason no doubt. 
Just had a look at her in Miramar;
Sold in 1970 and renamed Agelos Michael. 
She did not last long as on 29.10.1971 she had a fire and sank 5.20N 82.03E.
Were you based mainly Oz and far east with her?

Hawkey01


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## Ron Stringer (Mar 15, 2005)

hawkey01 said:


> The Scorton was quite large to only have MF. Cannot remember how this odd arrangement came about that some could sail deep sea with only MF. Some odd ball reason no doubt.


You may be surprised to learn that any ship over 300 grt only needed to carry MF in order to comply with the carriage requirements! Between 300 grt and 1600 grt that consisted of a 2182 kHz radiotelephone installation. Above 1600 grt it involved a radiotelegraph (Morse) installation covering 500 kHz and 6 other frequencies in the 405-525 kHz band.

Any HF facilities that were provided were completely optional, regardless of the size of the vessel. Some owners opted not to fit anything other than the bare minimum MF installation and that was still the case into the 1970s at least. You could hear some poor R/Os of those vessels requesting QSP? on 500 kHz all over the place.


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## hawkey01 (Mar 15, 2006)

Ron,

thanks for the info. 

Yes I recall the pleading of many a poor soul requesting QSP. Seem to remember a lot of the old tubs that Mavrolean had like Maple Hill etc had only MF. I did not realise that it was an optional extra. 

I got wise to the Greek ships though. Most were genuine but there were a few lazy souls who just could not be bothered!

Neville - Hawkey01


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## 7woodlane (Apr 20, 2009)

There must have been plenty of vessels without H/F transmitters in the Fifties.
The Zini of EDs (Liberty ship) still with her original Mackay radio station was no exception. So why didn't the previous R/O tell East Ham the one and only transmitter wasn't working. All aerials were down in port because of cargo working so I could not test the transmitter before sailing. I didn't realise I had a problem till we were half way down the Thames, bound for W.Africa. Clueless, after a while I gave up trying to fix the transmitter. I told the captain. I'll leave his comments out. By this time we are in thick fog off Dover and so we had to drop the hook. Unbelievably we had stopped within Aldis range of LLoyd's signal station there, and we signalled our problem to them. Incredibly there was a Mci Tech on the spot and he came out within minutes (by pilot cutter?), repaired the fault, tuned everything up and departed. With that the fog lifted and off we went. We didn't live happily ever after. Tuning in Portisheadradio for the H/F traffic lists was a nightmare. I never did find that spot on the dial. My belated thanks to the R/Os of other ED ships (who must have sensed my predicament) who copied Portisheadradio and any messages for the Zini and delivered them to me by hand from port to port along the west coast. As an introduction to single operator ships I could have done without any of that, other than the aforementioned kindness.


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## david.hopcroft (Jun 29, 2005)

After my stint as a Junior RO, I was told to get a Radar Cert. The next course at Riversdale began in April - 3 months away. The 'meanwhile' was an MF only job - the Marchon Trader, Whitehaven to Casablanca for phosphates. It didn't dawn on me at first, but after the initial shock, it was not so bad as we never really went out of UK range, even for a T10A. You had to pick the right time though, but GPK was usually on the ball each time.

David
+


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## david.hopcroft (Jun 29, 2005)

I seem to remember that there was a beer allocation on Mobil Tankers. Two cans/bottles per week of whatever there was. San Miguel - 1967 variety was always welcome.

David
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