# Wireless room spares



## Harry Nicholson

Any of you fine chaps recall the spares we carried by regulation? Was it two spare valves for each one of that type in use? And three for every two in use? Something of the sort methinks.
I'm thinking of the stocktake we would need to do before the start of voyage. Was the spares cupboard ever inspected and checked by some shore-side authority?
I'm attempting to write a bit of memoir about commissioning Brocklebank's Mawana's wireless gear for her maiden voyage in 1958. Don Butterworth was my boss. Tom Eggleston was Master.


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## sparks69

The Radio Surveyor in Swansea just looked at my incredibly organised spares cupboard and said OK.
My experience was that when something went wrong it was usually something that wasn't on the spares list. Thankfully the radar spares usually held loads of components !


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## mikeharrison

I sailed with a R/O on a Ferry who was a bit (ahem!) obsessive about ac***ulating a shack full of spares and tools and who knew each page in the RS catalogue.

I will always remember meeting the Electrical/Electronics Superintendent coming out of the shack and shaking his head in wonderment and saying "He (the R/O) has got THREE OSCILLOSCOPES!" . 

This at a time when no other Ferry in the Fleet even had one Oscilloscope.
 
Regards, Mike


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## P.Arnold

I recall, for valves. “ one valve for every three of a type, or part thereof”
3 valves of one type carry 1 spare
5 valves, carry 2 spare.

Many valves I found in the spares drawer, “Used but good”


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## YM-Mundrabilla

_“Used but good”_

Sounds like my stock of light globes and lawn mower spark plugs.(Jester)

(until you need to use them that is ...............)


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## sparks69

U B G - now there is a subject that caused problems !!


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## DickGraham

I don't remember much about the spares except "Used but Good"!

And, of course, the "dipping fahrenheit thermometer".


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## Harry Nicholson

P.Arnold said:


> I recall, for valves. “ one valve for every three of a type, or part thereof”
> 3 valves of one type carry 1 spare
> 5 valves, carry 2 spare.
> 
> Many valves I found in the spares drawer, “Used but good”


Thank you; that's illuminating. Perhaps Brocklebanks carried more spares - i recall an incident with the HF tx Siemens SB186x. En route up the Hooghli, the main power valve failed (wish I could remember the name of that large valve with an anode top cap). 
We had TWO spares for that single valve. 
Removed the failure and asked the junior to pass me a spare. He fumbled and dropped it onto the deck - bust. I got the last spare myself and fitted it. 
As I attached the connection to the top cap, it broke away from the glass leaving a tiny trace of metal on the pip.
I wrapped a towel around the valve, and another around my face (goggles fitted). With the big valve between my knees, I filed away enough of the glass pip to expose more metal. Then gingerly applied a drop of solder to the tiny bit of wire Then soldered the anode connection in place - whereupon we were back on air.


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## Wismajorvik

807, 813?
Spare valves, lamps, fuses and brushes. Nothing for the VHF.
AVO minor, couple of bent screwdrivers and a 100 watt soldering iron seemed to be the norm.


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## sparks69

Luxury - TWO bent screwdrivers. I had to MAKE one on the British Scientist (?) when converting cabins into luxury Apprentice accommodation.
The previous R/O had forgotten to re-order replacements.
Happy Daze.


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## duncs

You were lucky to have spares!


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## Mad Landsman

sparks69 said:


> Luxury - TWO bent screwdrivers. I had to MAKE one on the British Scientist (?) when converting cabins into luxury Apprentice accommodation.
> The previous R/O had forgotten to re-order replacements.
> Happy Daze.


Did you make it with the bend, or add the bend later(==D)


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## J. Davies

1981 I was on board a Hong Kong registered ship calling at a few ports on the Aussie coast. In Sydney the local radio inspector came on board, quite obviously looking for defects due to a cabotage dispute raging in Oz at that time. Unions and inspectors swarming everywhere making life difficult. This bloke could find nothing wrong. The logs and batteries and equipment were all in good order. Finally he put us down for a deficiency; no non-magnetic screwdriver for radar maintenance . Ship agent was scrambled and scoured the shops for said screwdriver, which he found after some hours. Ship was released to sail to next port but we had missed the pilot slot so were one day delayed. True story.


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## Ron Stringer

My visit to a ship at Shellhaven to review some trials equipment coincided with a Post Office survey of the (MIMCo) radio station by the infamous Harry Gilder. A local MIMCo technician was in attendance. 

Harry could find nothing wrong with any of the equipment or do***entation but eventually said he would not give clearance because the spares were not in compliance with the UK's Radio Rules' requirement that there should be an amount (I believe 1oz.) of petroleum jelly - better known by its trade name, Vaseline. There was indeed a tin of Vaseline (marked with the proper quantity) present in the Radio Room but someone had taken a finger swipe across the surface, removing a small amount of the content. Harry claimed that therefore there was less than the required amount present in the tin and he could not approve the installation as being compliant. 

As the ship was due to sail with the tide, the MIMCo technician had to drive posthaste to East Ham depot to collect another tin of Vaseline.

It happened to be a Shell tanker and I'm sure that the engine room had enough suitable grease to submerge the surveyor never mind coat any battery terminals or other metal surfaces needing protection against corrosion, but "rules are rules", "it's more than my job's worth ...."


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## Varley

As the seagoing towrag on attachment to East Ham's tech staff one leave it often fell to me to be left holding the Radio Surveyor's hand (not a requirement except when Harry was on the job). A thorough man indeed.

There is the story (possibly Ron's) of his grasping the mains leads to the DF Set only to find that the insulation remained only between the poles and not on the outside where Harry was then completing the circuit across the mains. I am told he swore the technician in attendance to say nothing of the jig that he danced until disconnected and I certainly did not hear that story until he must have been long gone.

I did take the opportunity to have him sign off on my six months sea time and his signature it is on my MRGC (M/57).


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## R651400

#8 .. Siemens SB186 shortwave transmitter PA valve (RF pentode) 4069A.


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## Harry Nicholson

R651400 said:


> #8 .. Siemens SB186 shortwave transmitter PA valve (RF pentode) 4069A.


That's excellent, good sir. They look to be what I recall. I had it in mind the valve was a beam tetrode - but, as you say, an RF pentode.
You did well to locate that image.


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## david.hopcroft

I had a valve tester on my last ship. Had never seen one before, but it turned out to be part of the Chief Eng's gear and the installers didn't know where it was meant to go. I saw off a couple of the 'Used but Good' valves before I got the measure of it !

Fond memories of the SB186. Not brilliant, but I don't remember any problems - it just worked ok. 

David
+


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## R651400

#17 ... SB186 info from an old text book and 4069A pic from Fleabay amazingly still available today..
Wouldn't like to comment on why RF pentode and not beam tetrode except what valve manufacturer Siemens preferred.


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## duncs

I've always thought that MIMCO had somehow acquired a huge amount of 807 beam tetrodes, and designed all their tx,s around it. Never had a problem with it.


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## R651400

Philips (Eindhoven) apparently had the patent on RF transmitting pentodes and to get round this British scientists developed the beam tetrod that became the ubiquitous 807 for RF power and KT66 for AF.


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## expats

I took over a ship at very, very short notice in Leith (sailing within hours)..The R/O had already gone so no 'handover'...We'd sailed when I got to looking over the spares cupboard...It looked neat and tidy with an up-to-date list...

Sadly, when I checked the valves, loads looked 'used'..The carboard boxes were opened but the opened end was at the bottom so they all looked new.

Just the one trip up the Baltic and I was off..but my spares demand, on leaving, raised eyebrows at the depot,


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## sparks69

R651400 said:


> Philips (Eindhoven) apparently had the patent on RF transmitting pentodes and to get round this British scientists developed the beam tetrod that became the ubiquitous 807 for RF power and KT66 for AF.


That explains it, but not why they all seemed to be made in the USSR ?


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## Buck Taylor

I know this is a bit off the theme, but I recall when I was R/O on a UASC K class heading for Aqaba in Jordan I think around 1986. I received an msg from the owners saying a complete crew change would take place on arrival Aqaba. It was an all Pakistani contingent that awaited us when we docked. The silver service was swept away and replaced by a large bowl of rice and a bowl of chicken curry...sign of things to come....I got the impression from the RO I was handing over to that they were manning the ship due to our incompetence!
During the handover he insisted I flash up the main transmitter (not permitted in port) as he main occupation would be making R/T calls. I done a quick QSO with GKA to placate him. When I showed him the spares locker, he declared it wasn't his business dealing with such things and that the Lecky would handle that sort of thing.
Fast forward a year and I'm in Liverpool docks on another UASC ship chatting with the Marconi technician who came on board. He told me that the ship in question had arrived in Liverpool without radars and most of the communication/navigation faulty. The entire Marconi tech team spent a week putting the faulty gear back in order before they could sail. So much for cutting costs....


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## Chris Wordsworth

In 1970 I joined a German Hanas Line ship in the middle of the night outside the three mile zone off Cape Town. The ship would not stop so there was no official takeover of the radio room. Early next morning the captain introduced himself and wanted me to send a telegram. He said non of the equipment was working. The first box I opened when looking for spares was full of condoms. A very red faced German captain quickly left with the box saying that it belongs in the medicine chest.


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## Moulder

One item I always remembered as being a requirement in the radio room spares was a 'Half pound bull pane hammer'!


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## Ron Stringer

Don't forget the contact burnisher and the smooth file.


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## R651400

sparks69 said:


> That explains it, but not why they all seemed to be made in the USSR ?


Hard to believe if the Oceanspan oscillator valve type EF50 had not arrived early 1941 in the UK from Philips Eindhoven by lorry in their thousands including the machinery and wherewithal to manufacture them Britain's radar development would have ceased there and then to catastrophic consequences on WW2's outcome.


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## Roger Bentley

*Hammer*



Moulder said:


> One item I always remembered as being a requirement in the radio room spares was a 'Half pound bull pane hammer'!


Moulder, There was an old joke in Brocklebanks that this item's inclusion was credited to W H Bailey the Chief Brocklebank Radio Superintendent. He was in post from 1922, and I remember being interviewed by him when I applied to Brocklebanks in late 1951. Regards, Roger


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## Mad Landsman

Moulder said:


> One item I always remembered as being a requirement in the radio room spares was a 'Half pound bull pane hammer'!


Is that an eight ounce ball peen, or even ball pein? 
I know you chaps are not actual muckanical injuneers but bull pane? what is that? :sweat:


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## spongebob

Just the right size pene to hit the morse key with when frustrated ?


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## Roger Bentley

*Eh!*



Mad Landsman said:


> Is that an eight ounce ball peen, or even ball pein?
> I know you chaps are not actual muckanical injuneers but bull pane? what is that? :sweat:


Malcolm, I just assumed it was a typo - there are plenty on this site! Did not feel the need to comment on this one.
At 86 I have created a few myself no doubt, as eyesight deteriorates.
Yes it is a ball pen hammer, happy now? Cheers, Roger


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## Mad Landsman

Roger Bentley said:


> Malcolm, I just assumed it was a typo - there are plenty on this site! Did not feel the need to comment on this one.
> At 86 I have created a few myself no doubt, as eyesight deteriorates.
> Yes it is a ball pen hammer, happy now? Cheers, Roger


Apologies if my attempted humour failed to hit the mark. (EEK)

Ball pen hammer, I like it! - now that would be for hitting what some folk annoyingly call a Biro, would it? (Jester) 

Have a nice day.


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## Varley

Better that than some accessory to a bizarre chastity device.


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## Roger Bentley

*Oops*



Mad Landsman said:


> Apologies if my attempted humour failed to hit the mark. (EEK)
> 
> Ball pen hammer, I like it! - now that would be for hitting what some folk annoyingly call a Biro, would it? (Jester)
> 
> Have a nice day.



Malcolm, Thanks. Guess in my day they missed the I in pein! Who typed our list obviously had the dreaded shakes. Best wishes, Roger


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## Engine Serang

There was a "Spare" in the wireless cabin of every ship I sailed on.


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## OilJiver

_perhaps_, slight overstatement serang


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## Engine Serang

OilJiver said:


> _perhaps_, slight overstatement serang


Perhaps indeed.
Why are they convulsed over a ball pein hammer when they let Mr and Mrs GMDSS take a wrecking ball to the Radio Room>


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## R651400

All same diminishing "oilies" engine room numbers to advancing technology.


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## Varley

It probably was a ball pain hammer until the plumbers got to describe it in writing.


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## Engine Serang

In fairness we're not great at writing but we can always draw a wee diagram.


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## spongebob

Really, it's a ball hammer , the knob does the peinng/peaning / piening


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## Mad Landsman

Quite right Bob! This is what the SOED has to say about it: 

*pein* noun var. of peen noun.

*peen* noun. Also pein. L17.
[ORIGIN Origin uncertain: cf. peen verb, pane noun².]
The end of a hammer head opposite to the face, esp. when sharp.

*peen* verb trans. E16.
[ORIGIN App. of Norse origin: cf. Swedish dial. pena, päne, Danish dial. pene, paene, Norwegian dial. penna, paenna.]
Beat thin with a hammer, hammer out; strike with the peen of a hammer.

I'm now beginning to wish I hadn't commented on it....(==D)


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## spongebob

Mad Landsman said:


> Quite right Bob! This is what the SOED has to say about it:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm now beginning to wish I hadn't commented on it....(==D)


To finally hammer this matter out ,
We also have the Cross Pein and the line pein hammers with chisel style head fore and aft or athwartships as used by tinsmiths, panel beaters etc .
Could be used for chopping wires in the wireless room if no side cutters in the kit.


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## Engine Serang

spongebob said:


> Really, it's a ball hammer , the knob does the peinng/peaning / piening


A Spare and a Knob in the radio room, sounds about right.


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## Ron Stringer

Engine Serang said:


> A Spare and a Knob in the radio room, sounds about right.


ES, such envy of those who enjoyed the best job aboard! But you shouldn't have let that envy make you so bitter.


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## Engine Serang

I'm neither envious or bitter but I enjoy spreading false news.

If God didn't believe in False News he wouldn't have set up Ships Nostalgia.


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## Varley

Best job aboard. I will pretend to be with you on that Ron but only because ES and Bob are just outside the tent peining in.

(It really was much, much more fun doing elecktrickery shipwide, and no fkg crew lists to type either).


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## Ron Stringer

Six years at sea and never, ever, typed a crew list or any other do***ent for the ship, Master or shipowners. Any and all clerical work performed by me aboard ship was for my employer, Marconi Marine and in pursuance of operating a radio station.

If you abhorred the work of a ship's writer, you should have chosen your employer more carefully, David. Signs off with a smug smirk.


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## Varley

I went where my employer sent me, Ron. Marconi Marine - perhaps Stan dispatched only his best boys to where they could get clerical bloody bonuses.


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## Ron Stringer

Varley said:


> I went where my employer sent me, Ron. Marconi Marine - perhaps Stan dispatched only his best boys to where they could get clerical bloody bonuses.


Dunno about the substance in that claim David. My time at sea preceded Stan's involvement - my dealings with him came much later, as his boss. While I was an R/O I took great care to avoid any involvement with East Ham depot - had it marked on my career plan as "Here be dragons."


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## Paul Braxton

192 quid bonus every month with Ben Line in 1980 for doing clerical work, articles, etc.? I must have been one of Stan's good lads! Filmstar wages in those days alright.


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## Varley

Nothing wrong with East Ham. R/Oing or (from admittedly brief experience) techying. Dave Brown and the team, not all names remembered I am afraid, but a largely happy bunch as long as one didn't break anyone's warding file through misuse, especially when the anyone was Irish!


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## P.Arnold

Ron Stringer said:


> Six years at sea and never, ever, typed a crew list or any other do***ent for the ship, Master or shipowners. Any and all clerical work performed by me aboard ship was for my employer, Marconi Marine and in pursuance of operating a radio station.
> 
> If you abhorred the work of a ship's writer, you should have chosen your employer more carefully, David. Signs off with a smug smirk.


Sailing with Mobil, I recall having to do the crew lists for immigration.
For several months we were lightering off the Texas gulf coast.
USA immigration requested all crew lists be in alphabetical order.
As we had a substantial number of crew members, 40+ being of Asian extraction with some names longer than the alphabet, and the remainder, Brits.
The Asian crew did not change, but the Brit members would change one at a time after 4 months or so. I soon came to an agreement with immigration to have two crew lists. As I had a one of those copying machines were you typed on a wax type paper and then put it on a drum and rotated the drum which made copies.

A small price to pay for doing about 6 hours a week on the key. Those were the sailing hours out to the VLCC and back.


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## R651400

Never experienced radio company employment but today enjoy the nostalgia of articles in "Marconi Mariner"and especially the list of ships under each GTZM depot *here*.


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## Troppo2

R651400 said:


> Never experienced radio company employment but today enjoy the nostalgia of articles in "Marconi Mariner"and especially the list of ships under each GTZM depot *here*.


There is some fascinating stuff there.


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## gordonarfur

*Radio spares*

During my time at sea , i had 3 visits from R/I,s none of whom even enquired about spares let alone checked them. An R/I in Hobart visited my ship and tried to come the old madam with me regarding the transmissions that emanated from the radio room of that fine vessel. He threatened to hold the ship until the problem (QRI/QRH) was solved, the tx came from Noahs ark and I merely informed him that I worked on the ship but did not own it and Hobart is not a bad place to rest up for a while.!! . We duly sailed on time so I guess he must have had a bad day.


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## hawkey01

Posted by new member Richard-T in incorrect area. I have moved to correct location - Hawkey01


I worked for Philips in Australia from 1967 to 1996. In my early days we had a very large factory in Adelaide (Hendon) that manufactured receiving valves and B&W picture tubes amongst it's many electronic components and finished products. With the change-over from valves to solid-state electronics in "browngoods" (radios, TVs, etc) in the 1970s there was no longer a big demand for valves and many Philips tube production lines were sold either to the Far East or Eastern Europe. I think the Hendon line went to Japan but memory could be wrong. We certainly bought our replacement market receiving valves from Japan afterwards.

The USSR was a long way behind the West in introducing solid-state gear just about anywhere, including their military, so it's hardly a surprise to find them (and maybe China?) as the main source of transmitting tubes - and also as a source of tubes for the audiophile market.


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## Mad Landsman

hawkey01 said:


> Posted by new member Richard-T ....
> 
> The USSR was a long way behind the West in introducing solid-state gear just about anywhere, including their military, so it's hardly a surprise to find them (and maybe China?) as the main source of transmitting tubes - and also as a source of tubes for the audiophile market.


I remember reading back in the 70s that Soviet kit was claimed to be built to better withstand EMP from any exo-atmospheric burst and that was a possible reason to retain valves.
At that time solid state kit was quite delicate, but nowadays who still regularly uses a wrist band to earth? - I do use an anti static work mat though. (Thumb)


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## Larry Bennett

Not strictly related to this thread but when I was studying for my MRGC in Bristol there was a wonderful shop in Newfoundland Road called "Helmore and Hunt". An Aladdin's cave of vintage radio equipment and spares. If you ever needed to replace a valve they would put the old one on the tester and refuse to sell you a new one if the old valve was still functional. Sadly the shop long demolished for the M32 into Central Bristol but I am sure generations of radio enthusiasts in Bristol remember the place with affection.

Larry +


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## J. Davies

Hello Larry

Yes I remember that place. I had a Marconi Elettra receiver in need of a few new valves and they had all I needed. I would spend some evenings (when not in the King's Head at the top of Gloucester Road) listening to Portishead and the nearby shipping on MF to improve my CW before the final test. I would on occasion wander into the shop just to browse around with no real mission in mind. The chaps there didn't seem to care and left me to it.
Here in Singapore when I first arrived more than 40 years ago there was a similar shop at the basement of the famous Sim Lim Tower, full of AR88's and RA17's. It was radio Mecca. Also, long gone.

John


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## IvortheEngine

Paul Braxton said:


> 192 quid bonus every month with Ben Line in 1980 for doing clerical work, articles, etc.? I must have been one of Stan's good lads! Filmstar wages in those days alright.


Me too Paul


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## R651400

Some free lance outfits were paying £120 and over in 1960.
God knows what it would be in 1980.


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## IvortheEngine

R651400 said:


> Some free lance outfits were paying £120 and over in 1960.
> God knows what it would be in 1980.


It never made my fortune but it put a dent in the bar bill


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## duncs

R651400 said:


> Never experienced radio company employment but today enjoy the nostalgia of articles in "Marconi Mariner"and especially the list of ships under each GTZM depot *here*.


Have just come across this post. Brilliant R65, I didn't know such a site existed. I downloaded one, mid '73, at random. It brought back many memories.
Many thanks for the link.

Best rgds, Duncs


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## R651400

I think it was a QSP of a QSP originating from Larry Bennet GKA.. 
Always worth a regurgitation and read. 
Maybe it's me but there seems to be a lot more coverage of GTZM office wallahs than ROs but still enjoyable reading.


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## phdad

If a failure occurred and there were no spares on board was the radio officer typically able to get those spares at the next port of call?


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## Troppo

phdad said:


> If a failure occurred and there were no spares on board was the radio officer typically able to get those spares at the next port of call?


Depends what the failure was...if it was for a major piece of equipment, and there were no spares...yes.

But, of course, that depends on the port...


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## P.Arnold

Troppo said:


> Depends what the failure was...if it was for a major piece of equipment, and there were no spares...yes.
> 
> But, of course, that depends on the port...


Several “radio” companies, Marconi, Radio Holland, SAIT for example had regional offices globally. There were other independent radio companies also providing service and basic discrete spares. Many shipping companies subscribed to R.A.M.A.C either through rental maintenance contracts or otherwise. (Ron, help me out).
The RAMAC organisation had a publication listing the ports and service provisions at the individual ‘depots’.


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## david.hopcroft

Years ago in Portland Maine, on a Saturday afternoon, a tech came aboard to fix our RMS2 radar. A peculiar resistor behind the CRT had gone duff. Everything was closed down, but he said he could find something among his amateur radio friends, and did I was to go with him. You bet. He found what he wanted and we went back via his favourite watering hole and my round. We went and sat down and when the beers came, he asked how old I was. Good job I had my uniform on as the answer was 19. Not enough for Maine !!

David
+


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## Wismajorvik

Steaming down to Australia the auto alarm failed on test. Fault was a Siemens relay, o/c coil. No spare. Attempted to repair but the wire was too fine. Radioed ahead to Oz but on arrival no spare but an interested radio surveyor. Was permitted to sail with 500kcs rx audio fed to the bridge speaker for monitoring by the personnel there. Spare arrived at next port in the PG.
No spares carried for the marine VHF, (not required under existing regs.) which resulted in difficulties until I managed to extract a set of valves from the ship owners.


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## Troppo

Wismajorvik said:


> Was permitted to sail with 500kcs rx audio fed to the bridge speaker for monitoring by the personnel there. S


What was the point of that? Could the mates suddenly read CW?

It would have driven them crazy...bet they turned it down.

(Jester)


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## trotterdotpom

Troppo said:


> What was the point of that? Could the mates suddenly read CW?
> 
> It would have driven them crazy...bet they turned it down.
> 
> (Jester)


I'm sure they did, Troppo. I gave up tuning the Lodestar DF to 500 kcs so that it could take a bearing, however useless, of a distress if the auto alarm activated. 5 minutes after, it would be retuned to some music station.

By the way, I bet you met that surveyor that Wismo. was talking about.

John T


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## phdad

As I have been told by an older British radio officer, now passed on, that on several of his ships he had young Indian boys who would stay in the radio shack and listen for ..._ _ _ ...
while the RO was sleeping or at mess, and if heard to to get the RO as soon as possible.


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## Varley

Dr.Jim. following on from your #74 . This may amuse you.


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## phdad

Varley: thank you. Yes, I think back now and I believe that he did call them “watchers.” Great find.

Regards and stay healthy in these trying times.


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## les.edgecumbe

st "La Loma", Buries Markes (1974).
Junior R/O was an ex vending machine engineer. Using a pile of Ledex motors, Nixie tubes and anything else in the locker, we ended up with this One Arm Bandit. It took 10p's. Fixed odds of course, but a welcome diversion in the bar. It made a bloody embarrassing fortune (duly went to RNLI).
Rather naughty using spares like this, but 1. we knew exactly where there were if required and 2. we knew they all worked !!!


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