# Boiler Suit



## A.D.FROST

How did you wash yours (Before the Posh ships)Steam hose in drum. (Steam Queens need not answer only Scavenge crawlers)(Cloud)


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## Tony Morris

Yes, drum with steam hose, normally down by the prop shaft as less chance of tipping over when ship was rolling, also sometimes in the shower giving a good pounding with feet.

Tony


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## Varley

The steam queens are unlikely to answer. You will have given the half with condenseritise heart attacks at the thought of the water consumption. The other half will be mortally offended.


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## Satanic Mechanic

Varley said:


> The steam queens are unlikely to answer. You will have given the half with condenseritise heart attacks at the thought of the water consumption. The other half will be mortally offended.


You know it's only now sitting here looking back that I realise the true depth of steam ship water paranoia, here is something I learned - the best water saving technique for domestic water before actually turning it off completely was to turn off the cold water and turn the heat of the hot water, consumption would plummet.


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## forthbridge

On most of the ben boats in the 1960s one of the Chinese crew would was the boiler suits for a small payment


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## NINJA

Tepol for thanking out or trying to scavenge sh1t.


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## Cwatcher

On one clean oil BP tanker the C/E used to get me to crack open a tank lid whenever we carried White Spirit. He would then soak his boiler suits in there, secured by a line, for a couple of hours. They came out almost like new.


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## makko

Always in the dirty washing machine, NEVER in a steam heated drum! I saw too many accidents when the steam hose was left in too long - i.e. shrunken, perished boiler suits! They had to get polyester BS's from the C/Stwd! Ha ha ha! Just adding suffering to misery.
Rgds.
Dave


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## cueball44

I wonder how these lads got their boiler suites looking clean and tidy.


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## surfaceblow

Before getting an used washing machine in the engine room we use to use the steam recip air compressor, a 55 gallon drum and a plumbers plunger. The Plumbers Plunger was attached to the air compressor crosshead when the drum was filled with water and boiler suits the compressor was just bearing stroking. Too fast the boiler suits turned to rags.

Joe


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## chadburn

cueball44 said:


> I wonder how these lads got their boiler suites looking clean and tidy.


Steam Drain in a galvanised bucket half filled with water and a touch of Washing Soda(Thumb)


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## Burntisland Ship Yard

chadburn said:


> Steam Drain in a galvanised bucket half filled with water and a touch of Washing Soda(Thumb)


Washing Soda aka Dobi Dust !


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## Nigel Wing

Different for each era.
BP in the 60's with Indian Crew, the Tindal did them for a fee paid at the end of the trip.
P&O in the 70's and 80's, the steward would collect them weekly and take them to the ships laundry then return them to your cabin in pristine condition.
Transocean Maritime Agencies in the 80's and 90's, we had a boilersuit washing machine, and did them ourselves, no problem.


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## makko

Nigel Wing said:


> P&O in the 70's and 80's, the steward would collect them weekly and take them to the ships laundry then return them to your cabin in pristine condition.


Weekly?! Was that deckside, Nigel?

I always had seven boilersuits, new each trip. One was a spare. Two boilersuits per day in the washing machine, one per watch. On day work, two every second day in the washing m/c. Maybe on extended standby, doing a double header, a third fresh boiler suit. I didn't want to upset the chief!
Rgds.
Dave


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## makko

p.s. ....and sufficient dhobi dust/toothpaste/shampoo etc to last the trip and not have to dip into the slop chest. E/R socks in Hong Kong each trip and over the wall at the end.
Rgds.
Dave


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## Satanic Mechanic

Ah engine room socks were always problematic, they had to be the right combination of the correct material, in good enough condition to be functional, but old enough to be discarded at the end of the trip .

You couldn't have them developing holes half way through the trip neither could they be in good enough condition to take home at the end of the trip. Cotton or wool by preference of course. 

I once joined with some old woolly walking socks - bad mistake, firstly they turned out to be indestructible and secondly the well do***ented insulating properties of wool did not lend them to use in an engine room in the tropics. I damn near developed trench foot such was the permanent state of immersion of my feet in sweat. 

Engine room underwear was not without its problems either - diesel/fuel oil soaked skiddys being particularly notable as a fire and health hazard. They often had so many holes in them I was left wondering if it was me or the other engineers who had more or less than the normal amount of orifices. I remain traumatised to this day with the memory of a large proportioned 3/E trying to get into an awkward position on a steam ship to get to a flange - there was a ripping sound and there he was sort of bent double with his nut sack hanging out of the gusset of his boilersuit, worse he was manouvering in such a way that the said nut sack was descending onto the spindle of a steam valve. There was a kind of brief 'sizzling ' noise........................i'm sorry I cant go on - the memory still has me doubled up 25 years later


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## Varley

SM. Obviously one needs to change before attempting to dance the dance, one is only supposed to test the flammability of the gas not the underwear. Unless it was a superheated line the risk was one of scalding rather than of an incendiary nature.

When pants and shirts get to the dilapidated stage they go into the travelling drawer this is used for when I venture off the Island. I need then take only sufficient smart wear (the shirt for obvious reasons the underwear, well one lives in hope) for the occasions when one is expected to be in company. For the travel and casual periods the travelling wardrobe is used and simply thrown away at the end of the day.


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## OilJiver

Satanic Mechanic said:


> .......Engine room underwear was not without its problems either - diesel/fuel oil soaked skiddys being particularly notable as a fire and health hazard. They often had so many holes in them I was left wondering if it was me or the other engineers who had more or less than the normal amount of orifices. I remain traumatised to this day with the memory of a large proportioned 3/E trying to get into an awkward position on a steam ship to get to a flange - there was a ripping sound and there he was sort of bent double with his nut sack hanging out of the gusset of his boilersuit, worse he was manouvering in such a way that the said nut sack was descending onto the spindle of a steam valve. There was a kind of brief 'sizzling ' noise........................i'm sorry I cant go on - the memory still has me doubled up 25 years later


V funny, thanks SM.

Was once asked by a non-seafaring friend how much gear I needed to take with me for a 6 month trip. Didn’t go into much detail but did explain importance of the two sets of skiddies & socks. 
Bastard chose to misinterpret what I said and still (when in company) refers to me as, “that grubby sod who only has 2 pairs of underpants”.


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## Duncan112

Bit like the old time firemen joining with 53 items - a deck of cards and a waistcoat.


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## Basil

> (Steam Queens need not answer only Scavenge crawlers)


HOW VERY DARE YOU!
BTW, ducky, what's a 'Scavenge crawler' (==D)


p.s. SM - hilarious, well not for the Third, of course.


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## Varley

It's a sort of air register where the suck lives before it is squeezed. It is traditional for the most junior plumbers to be rolled around inside it to make them dirty.


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## OilJiver

Basil said:


> HOW VERY DARE YOU!
> BTW, ducky, what's a 'Scavenge crawler' (==D)......


Well, sometimes… just sometimes…we might have a buddie scrub our back duckie!


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## Tony Morris

On the modern motor ships I sail on these days the owners expect you to survive on 2 boilersuits per 4 months contract, luckily I have a collection from previous greatful employers that I can dip into. Never bring any home anymore as the crew are lining up for them before I leave. I always wear one from another company when a super visits to wind them up about what cheapscates they are . Workshoes are the same, my last lot disappeared when my relief came up the gangway.

Tony


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## OilJiver

V, Air register? You must be Steamie Sparkie Leckie. 
But anyway… Suck?... Suck? 
No such thing as suck. Only squeeze. (And different hardness squeeze). 

Tony, did same boilersuit thing when anyone from office visiting. Nice clean one of course.


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## twogrumpy

Should have seen all the "laundry" that was scatterd round the engine room when we dropped a valve into the top of a B&W. See pic.

Slightly more entertaining than me attempting to fish a pair of skiddies out of the upper piston on a B&W, had to try and get them at the top of the stroke when they went airbourne.(Cloud)


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## Basil

> when we dropped a valve into the top of a B&W


Sounds like a stimulating experience (EEK)

You meant 'Doxford' in para 2?

Bas - only sailed on one diesel and that was a B&W 4S


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## surfaceblow

Tony Morris said:


> On the modern motor ships I sail on these days the owners expect you to survive on 2 boilersuits per 4 months contract, luckily I have a collection from previous greatful employers that I can dip into. Never bring any home anymore as the crew are lining up for them before I leave. I always wear one from another company when a super visits to wind them up about what cheapscates they are . Workshoes are the same, my last lot disappeared when my relief came up the gangway.
> 
> Tony


The Tanker Companies that I worked for had a similar policy on the white boiler suits that they supplied with the company name. Since these boiler suits had a large polyester content I use to order a supply of cotton boiler suits in the 60 day stores for the Engine Department. The only time any one in the Engine Department worn the White Boiler Suits was for meals or while they were washing the other boiler suits. The Captain also sold extra Company Supplied White Boiler Suits in the Slop Chest. It seem that only the Deck Officers were buying them.

Joe


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## twogrumpy

No Basil not a Doxford, opposed piston B&W. with oil cooled lower piston.

On boiler suits, what about the ones we used to pick up in Bombay, complete with sawn off sleeves and those little sewn buttons.


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## Basil

> opposed piston B&W


Sorry - didn't know about those.


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## twogrumpy

surfaceblow said:


> The Tanker Companies that I worked for had a similar policy on the white boiler suits that they supplied with the company name. Since these boiler suits had a large polyester content I use to order a supply of cotton boiler suits in the 60 day stores for the Engine Department. The only time any one in the Engine Department worn the White Boiler Suits was for meals or while they were washing the other boiler suits. The Captain also sold extra Company Supplied White Boiler Suits in the Slop Chest. It seem that only the Deck Officers were buying them.
> 
> Joe


BP's were good quality cotton boiler suits, shows some thought went into them, the rule pocket on the leg was designed to take a safety torch.


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## twogrumpy

Basil said:


> Sorry - didn't know about those.


(Jester)Missed nothing!! though I was told that B&W's were superior to Doxfords.


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## Varley

OilJiver said:


> V, Air register? You must be Steamie Sparkie Leckie.
> But anyway… Suck?... Suck?
> No such thing as suck. Only squeeze. (And different hardness squeeze).
> 
> Tony, did same boilersuit thing when anyone from office visiting. Nice clean one of course.


I suppose I was a Steamie-sparkie when I only did the earphonie thing. After that only a gas-turbinie-sparkie then Gotaverkenie-leckie although I did pretended to be a Steamie-Super for a bit, later on.

I do know that nature abhors a vacuum but I thought the text book description a bit long on wind. Anyway tell that to a babe in arms!

"Place where the air cools off as it waits to blow in and be squashed after having been squeezed a little when the bang escapes through the fan squeezer".


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## Nigel Wing

makko said:


> Weekly?! Was that deckside, Nigel?
> 
> I always had seven boilersuits, new each trip. One was a spare. Two boilersuits per day in the washing machine, one per watch. On day work, two every second day in the washing m/c. Maybe on extended standby, doing a double header, a third fresh boiler suit. I didn't want to upset the chief!
> Rgds.
> Dave


I was Lecky, always seemed to have enough boilersuits, clean one every day.


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## Satanic Mechanic

twogrumpy said:


> No Basil not a Doxford, opposed piston B&W. with oil cooled lower piston.
> 
> On boiler suits, what about the ones we used to pick up in Bombay, complete with sawn off sleeves and those little sewn buttons.


Ah technically speaking, after a long court case, the upper piston was an 'eccentric actuated reciprocating exhaust valve'


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## Farmer John

#25, looking at your photo, it is so difficult to follow the track of the "pipe" (excuse the non-engineers technical term), is it a Klein bottle?


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## makko

Farmer John,

The "base" is the valve disc, the periphery being ground to seal against the valve seat. The approximate diameter can be guessed from the chequer plate pattern. 

The "pipe" is the valve stem which should be standing "at attention" in this photo! The most likely culprit for this type of failure are the collets, little circular wedges that hold the valve in position. 

It looks also like this valve has a welded stem. In B&W engines, there were many failures of the weld in the 70-80's. The valve disc would fall into the engine with catastrophic consequences!

Rgds.
Dave


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## makko

*Short sleeve boiler suits! YIKES!*



twogrumpy said:


> On boiler suits, what about the ones we used to pick up in Bombay, complete with sawn off sleeves and those little sewn buttons.


Gadzooks, man!!! We would have gotten into severe trouble if we wore a sleeveless boiler suit or a ragged one for that matter - strict company policy. One scruffy fourth was told to deep six his entire collection. When talking to a mate of mine who worked for T&J, I couldn't believe that they were allowed in the E/R in shorts, vest and flip flops and we are talking about the 80's, not when Jason and his Argonauts were babes in arms!

Rgds.
Dave


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## twogrumpy

I was not really happy with the sleeveless version, easy way to get burnt, as for shorts and flip flops, no way.


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## ccurtis1

We used "Basol" in a drum of water heated with steam from the boiler reciprocating feed pump in the 60's


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## OilJiver

Varley said:


> ....."Place where the air cools off as it waits to blow in and be squashed after having been squeezed a little when the bang escapes through the fan squeezer".


Ticket in post.
Gas turbines you worked with V - any good? Fairly uncommon merchant ship fit.
Either way guess the boilersuit didn’t take too much stick.


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## Farmer John

Makko, I can follow it now, thanks.


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## OilJiver

makko said:


> Gadzooks, man!!! We would have gotten into severe trouble if we wore a sleeveless boiler suit or a ragged one for that matter......


Right enough M. Though plenty guys did wear short sleeves of course. (Some even cut off at shoulder and also remember one cowboy with boilersuit cut off at knees).
Used to try and acquire decent boilersuits (legitimately) from anywhere I could, Other companies, makers, shipyards etc. (So long as they were cotton). 
Among best, one unintentionally obtained from a Class Surveyor. Large letters on back said VISITOR.


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## Duncan112

The great prize was to liberate one of the harlequin style ones used by the container gangs in Australia, grey and red quaters were popular (and very jealously guarded by the legitimate owners) Somewhere I've got a lurid lime green one with the Conaust legend across the back - poly cotton so for drinking use only!!


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## OilJiver

Never saw one of those Duncan but sound the business.


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## makko

OilJiver said:


> Used to try and acquire decent boilersuits (legitimately) from anywhere I could, Other companies, makers, shipyards etc. (So long as they were cotton).
> Among best, one unintentionally obtained from a Class Surveyor. Large letters on back said VISITOR.


I used to buy mine at Greenberg's, really good quality and pure cotton!


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## Varley

After the Herald o f Enterprise disaster P&O re-branded the cross channel trade.

Our purchasing manager, the every diligent Archie Caldwell, got a batch of the most comfortable and hard wearing boiler suits ever. "P&O" was neatly obliterated by a Denholm Blue patch. I still have one. Never sure about having anything but white 'though, these were orange.


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## stevie burgess

ccurtis1 said:


> We used "Basol" in a drum of water heated with steam from the boiler reciprocating feed pump in the 60's


Wow ccurtis1 i haven't seen basol since i first went to sea in the mid 70's and i believe it got banned.


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## OilJiver

makko said:


> I used to buy mine at Greenberg's, really good quality and pure cotton!


Never managed to acquire one of those made of good cotton with twin seahorses on the back.
Bet SM has a case full of ‘em.


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## Barrie Youde

#9

Wonderful photograph!

Do you know its origin?


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## Varley

OilJiver said:


> Ticket in post.
> Gas turbines you worked with V - any good? Fairly uncommon merchant ship fit.
> Either way guess the boilersuit didn’t take too much stick.


P&W Free turbine configuration. I first heard of these when one my first Denholm ship and thereafter it was my ambition to get to them. By the time I did the fuel crisis had forced the attempt to burn shi't in them (BFO, washed to rid the salt, flocculated to help settle the water then to the purifiers to demonstrate how little the settling process had worked, injection of combustion water and vanadium inhibitor 'liquimag' then 'pink' liquimag, can't remember proper name, then finally homogenization - all attended by as much heat as the hot water 'boiler's could provided. If you were lucky the flame didn't go out when you changed from paraffin, MGT7, to sh't!). Burning sh't in aircraft engines! was there to be no end to the fun (perhaps not so much for the plumbers who prayed to the alfa laval god nightly for salvation).

At sea one is not too much troubled by the health of the commercial enterprise but they were the greatest of fun to be on and the first where I had become an integral part of the team (although still a Marconi man then) instead of a hanger-on in case of emergencies (or out of range of the world service for the football). They went for re-enginning and re-peopling (Germans, fair I suppose that's where they had been built) - no way I was going back to the earphonie thing so grateful to be taken on by the Diamond D as Leckie. First trip leckie, first trip on motor ship and it was a Gotaverken - learning curve helped by being able to watch most of the gubbins while it was working.

Denholm had had Morar but I missed her. Free piston gasifier. Later they got INZHENER YERMOSHKIN. I would have loved to see her but was then withering on that corporate vine. She had waste heat recovery on both GT trains and steam as well as gas turbines. When interviewing my first Ukrainian E/O Andriy Ostapenko (excellent education/training/certification regime) we were chatting about her.
"Ah! the ships that bankrupted the Baltic Fleet!" so I suppose they felt the pinch of fuel prices too! When burning what P&W had designed them for we could burn 300 Tons of paraffin a day!

(We also had a Paxman, I would have loved to see how that worked but often it didn't. I can no longer remember how many oil drums were required for the bits while stripping it down. Each shaft had a 1 MW AEG Thyristor dependent Shaft generator not fuel effective to run in port but often the only way of keeping on the lights)

I will post a control room picture, the boiler suite looks a little grubby. Perhaps I had been rolling about to make it look as if I was important.

YOU got me started, the difficulty is in the stopping!


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## muldonaich

Varley said:


> P&W Free turbine configuration. I first heard of these when one my first Denholm ship and thereafter it was my ambition to get to them. By the time I did the fuel crisis had forced the attempt to burn shi't in them (BFO, washed to rid the salt, flocculated to help settle the water then to the purifiers to demonstrate how little the settling process had worked, injection of combustion water and vanadium inhibitor 'liquimag' then 'pink' liquimag, can't remember proper name, then finally homogenization - all attended by as much heat as the hot water 'boiler's could provided. If you were lucky the flame didn't go out when you changed from paraffin, MGT7, to sh't!). Burning sh't in aircraft engines! was there to be no end to the fun (perhaps not so much for the plumbers who prayed to the alfa laval god nightly for salvation).
> 
> At sea one is not too much troubled by the health of the commercial enterprise but they were the greatest of fun to be on and the first where I had become an integral part of the team (although still a Marconi man then) instead of a hanger-on in case of emergencies (or out of range of the world service for the football). They went for re-enginning and re-peopling (Germans, fair I suppose that's where they had been built) - no way I was going back to the earphonie thing so grateful to be taken on by the Diamond D as Leckie. First trip leckie, first trip on motor ship and it was a Gotaverken - learning curve helped by being able to watch most of the gubbins while it was working.
> 
> Denholm had had Morar but I missed her. Free piston gasifier. Later they got INZHENER YERMOSHKIN. I would have loved to see her but was then withering on that corporate vine. She had waste heat recovery on both GT trains and steam as well as gas turbines. When interviewing my first Ukrainian E/O Andriy Ostapenko (excellent education/training/certification regime) we were chatting about her.
> "Ah! the ships that bankrupted the Baltic Fleet!" so I suppose they felt the pinch of fuel prices too! When burning what P&W had designed them for we could burn 300 Tons of paraffin a day!
> 
> (We also had a Paxman, I would have loved to see how that worked but often it didn't. I can no longer remember how many oil drums were required for the bits while stripping it down. Each shaft had a 1 MW AEG Thyristor dependent Shaft generator not fuel effective to run in port but often the only way of keeping on the lights)
> 
> I will post a control room picture, the boiler suite looks a little grubby. Perhaps I had been rolling about to make it look as if I was important.
> 
> YOU got me started, the difficulty is in the stopping!


they had massive fiat engines to constantly blacking out an old mans nightmare brgds kev.


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## Varley

The GTVs were first re-engined with Stork-Werkspoors. I think they got another which could have been Fiats/GMT but still twin shafted so shouldn't have has as much impact on the bridge I wouldn't have thought.

The Massive Fiat/GMTs were latterly Burmpac Bahamas, Blue Fin and Yellow Fin. Beastly things indeed. Before that there were the 'Fort' boats, renamed on the Eilat / Lavan Island run.


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## twogrumpy

Duncan112 said:


> The great prize was to liberate one of the harlequin style ones used by the container gangs in Australia, grey and red quaters were popular (and very jealously guarded by the legitimate owners) Somewhere I've got a lurid lime green one with the Conaust legend across the back - poly cotton so for drinking use only!!


Must be an Aussie thing, we picked some boilies up in Kwinana, one side was green, the other yellow, pockets on the green side were yellow and vice versa, and very smart they were.


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## OilJiver

Varley said:


> .........(We also had a Paxman, I would have loved to see how that worked but often it didn't. I can no longer remember how many oil drums were required for the bits while stripping it down. Each shaft had a 1 MW AEG Thyristor dependent Shaft generator not fuel effective to run in port but often the only way of keeping on the lights)
> 
> I will post a control room picture, the boiler suite looks a little grubby. Perhaps I had been rolling about to make it look as if I was important.
> 
> YOU got me started, the difficulty is in the stopping!


Thanks comprehensive reply V - interesting career, interesting kit. Not overly familiar with some items, though intimate knowledge of others mentioned. 
Similarly have hoped, on occasion, for esteemed Alpha to perform miracle. (Change water to something combustible mostly). 
Mixed feelings about much maligned Paxman, but do concede it most responsible for rendering boilersuits unfit for further use.
However, definitely remain inclined more toward stonecrusher apparatus. Don’t think you’ll get me converted to change my distorted view of thyristor technology. Haven’t had much experience of same, but that which I have had has been less than harmonious. 
Look forward to picture.


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## A.D.FROST

Never trust a first trip cadet with your boiler suit it ether it comes back pink(do not wash with red socks) or lost over the side(boiler suit tied to a rope and slung over the side,twisted till some thing gives).(Ouch)


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## Varley

I fear your use of harmonious must give a lie to your claim of lack of intimacy with the SCR. Perhaps your trouble was that the artist responsible for the works you laboured to admire were not German. Either AEG or Siemens and you would have not wanted another sleeping place.

Thyristor technology does bring about much in the way of harmonics (as this is a plumbers pitch I should point out that the Thyristor is not a musical instrument nor a player thereof). In my day there was no other semiconductor device man enough for power electronic switching. The kit was provided with harmonic filtering in order to counter them, their result otherwise would have been loss of motor torque and more heat generation. I never saw any of this.

These days the job is done with MOSFETS and PWM (I will not explain these as the first sounds like a garden pest and I confuse Pulse Width Modulation as morse code).

FatLeckie with Sears tool pouch (actually FatSparkie still), Foggie 3/E (can't remember name, terrible. Do remember why nickname). Rab Houston Jnr C/E. In ECR of Eurofreighter, NivoTester board in background. My first trip Leckie was Rab's first trip Chief.

BFO fkd turbines and for this BFO Bear was hanged every time a changeout due to burning sh't occurred. At the end of their time with us SeaTrain reverted to MGT7 but without scrupulous tank cleaning. This was Baby Bear. Baby Bear fkd turbines too but he got kicked around for it rather than hanged hence the eye, darned by Mother when I brought them both home. Bear is wearing a barstool cover as Tam O'Shanter.


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## OilJiver

Varley said:


> ...(as this is a plumbers pitch I should point out that the Thyristor is not a musical instrument nor a player thereof)..........FatLeckie with Sears tool pouch (actually FatSparkie still), Foggie 3/E (can't remember name, terrible. Do remember why nickname). Rab Houston Jnr C/E. In ECR of Eurofreighter, NivoTester board in background. My first trip Leckie was Rab's first trip Chief........


Used to take small portable musical instrument to sea with me in hope of learning to play. (Hohner Marine Band - Fact). 
Dropped out of boilersuit pocket once resulting in distorted harmonica. (Maybe not entirely fact).

Meanwhile, every picture tells a story. 

Chief looks relaxed & happy (& young): 
A) because he knows job backwards. 
B) has confidence of youth. 
C) is blissfully unaware of sh1t about to unfold because staff daren’t tell him.
(Suggest C, due to sheepish look of 3/E & Leckie)

If 3/E boilersuit started out white: 
A) he has sole responsibility for Paxman. 
B) he is manky git who does not change boilersuit often enough. 
(Assume A, as Chief & Leckie in close proximity – NB unless Chief & Leckie also stink).

Leckie (aside Leckie specific tool belt), not in Leckie attire. ( No leckie ever seen in such discoloured boilersuit).
A) Leckie has laid down in V of Paxman for a bit of shuteye when unexpectedly started by 3/E. 
B) he is manky git who does not change boilersuit often enough. 
(Unless supplementary staining to rear of boilersuit – assume B)


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## makko

A.D.FROST said:


> Never trust a first trip cadet with your boiler suit it ether it comes back pink(do not wash with red socks) or lost over the side(boiler suit tied to a rope and slung over the side,twisted till some thing gives).(Ouch)


Never put your washing in the clean m/c after the first trip deck cadet has used it. They normally cannot fathom what CLEAN and DIRTY mean. (I learned the hard way! Luckily, it was only two shirts ruined.)


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## saudisid

Regarding the Green / Yellow boiler suites when I was on the Manz run in 67 /68 and 69 / 70 this was United Stevedoring in Melbourne's . It was said they were this way so they could see if ships crews were nicking them. I still have mine !!


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## Varley

OilJiver said:


> ......
> 
> Leckie (aside Leckie specific tool belt), not in Leckie attire. ( No leckie ever seen in such discoloured boilersuit).
> A) Leckie has laid down in V of Paxman for a bit of shuteye when unexpectedly started by 3/E.
> B) he is manky git who does not change boilersuit often enough.
> (Unless supplementary staining to rear of boilersuit – assume B)


Alas and alack.I am undone. (Had it been "A" then would have been done to a turn - "Cherry red is the colour of Paxman's exhaust manifold!"


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## OilJiver

Dull red perhaps. 
But surely you will recall also riotous snarl of beast on start. (Should same actually occur). Ferocious sufficient to cause boilersuit changing alarm in those unaware, or awaken from even deepest slumber, long before full load.


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## Varley

Well one can give it credit for as many starts as there were stops. Some say the problem was because it was run at the behest of the BoT when on standby and would have been happy (ier) running at full load (on the GTVs it was rated at 1.2 MW from the terminal box). Of course the makers said to us they were in perfectly good service on the railways and it was something we were doing wrong. But many, many years later I read that they had been telling the railways the same thing but with the roles reversed.


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## Duncan112

The Paxman engine was designed to be overhauled in an inverted position to remove the pistons and a frame was available to turn the engine and support it - these were used shoreside and I am led to believe one RFA vessel had one. 

BP's River and Ity class had these engines - one stores indent from a frustrated Chief read "Part No XXXXX - overhaul frame and space to fit same" 

As I've said many times before never trust an engine beginning with P - Pielstick, Paxman or Polar


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## Varley

The problem is horses for courses. In all the ships I sailed on or had a hand building we were not constricted on space. The Naval Architect will always try for maximum power to weight so, principally, lighter and faster prime movers. HE MUST BE RESISTED. One might be able to load a few more tons of cargo with this mantra but who wants their cargo delayed, lost or spoiled due to delays or worse?

Wot evri skoolboi noe: more bits, faster bits directly proportional to broken bits.

I suspect those habitually using these contraptions in constricted spaces where there would be no enterprise should a more reliable alternative be chosen might be surprised at how sniffy we are being. The Haverton Hill OBOs had ample space for convention switchboards yet withdrawable starters were decreed as if nothing else would fit. Even Sunderland Forge might have got away with fixed starters without them gaining the accolade "Self Igniting".

Do not ignore the Naval Architect in any other respect he has the finest understanding of the merchant vessel as one can tell from their Institution's prime tenet "If the hole is big enough, the vessel will sink".


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## Varley

P? Pork Werkspoor.


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## Duncan112

Varley said:


> P? Pork Werkspoor.


Or even Poxford!!


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## Duncan112

Varley said:


> I suspect those habitually using these contraptions in constricted spaces where there would be no enterprise should a more reliable alternative be chosen might be surprised at how sniffy we are being. The Haverton Hill OBOs had ample space for convention switchboards yet withdrawable starters were decreed as if nothing else would fit. Even Sunderland Forge might have got away with fixed starters without them gaining the accolade "Self Igniting".


If I had ever had a hand in specifying for a switchboard I would have fitted a couple of spare breakers for the deck compressor, additional welding set etc that undoubtedly will be required later n life (No, not a space to fit this but a real, physical breaker to guard against the possibility of the genuine article being unobtainable at a later date.

One company I worked for had problems with vibration and were assured by some genius that a vibration compensator (read big motor with eccentric weight in the steering flat) would work wonders - this duly arrived, together with a breaker - to fit the breaker would mean blacking out and loss of cargo time so it didn't get fitted - UNTIL some brave person decided to do the job live (Including drilling the bars - greater faith in marigolds and the switchboard matting I have never heard of). Surprisingly all went well (did I mention it was Christmas Eve?) until the bolts on the bars were being tightened when the socket extension fell off the wrench and across the lower set of bars!!

Damage was extensive - so was the off hire but when I joined the ship a couple of years later the "Temporary" repairs to the bars using welding cable were still in use, having been accepted by Lloyds.

The vibration compensator - well when set in motion it shook so much it destroyed its bed plate and set the steering flat deck into some form of sinusoidal pattern - the motor I think finished up on one of the compressors the rest splash!!


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## twogrumpy

Duncan112 said:


> The Paxman engine was designed to be overhauled in an inverted position to remove the pistons and a frame was available to turn the engine and support it - these were used shoreside and I am led to believe one RFA vessel had one.
> 
> BP's River and Ity class had these engines - one stores indent from a frustrated Chief read "Part No XXXXX - overhaul frame and space to fit same"
> 
> As I've said many times before never trust an engine beginning with P - Pielstick, Paxman or Polar


Though memory may be playing tricks, I seem to recall Percy Paxman being inverted in situ one dry docking(Ity boat), no special frame being used.
Echo your comment on the lack of headroom on the Ity boats, the time spent sitting on top with the limited headroom makes me shudder even now, in particular when the coupling between the fuel pumps decided to self destruct, most times it was split cooloing water hoses I think.
Good early warning system though, air con fans running down, Paxman airstarting, as the pref trip operated, indicating time to put boiler suit on and head downwards.(Cloud)


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## Duncan112

twogrumpy said:


> Good early warning system though, air con fans running down, Paxman airstarting, as the pref trip operated, indicating time to put boiler suit on and head downwards.(Cloud)


If it started it was OK - it was the repetitive ZZZZZZ phut; ZZZZZ phut that usually signaled disaster. Only did a few weeks on the Security to finish my time and the TA behaved - the Dart was a different matter the Todd - Watson burner mismanagement system usually succeed in losing steam pressure and Percy used to sulk in his corner.

Mind, when I was doing my Chief's ticket there was one lad off one of the ferry companies that swore he used easy start on the Pielsticks - or at least did until the tin fell into the exhaust pipes between the Vee just as the engine caught - saved the job of removing the remaining lagging.


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## chadburn

2G, how's this for lack of headroom!!! Packards removed and those other P engines fitted.


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## Duncan112

chadburn said:


> 2G, how's this for lack of headroom!!! Packards removed and those other P engines fitted.


Ye Gods, I wouldn't have fancied going between the two engines when one or both were running.


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## chadburn

Duncan112 said:


> Ye Gods, I wouldn't have fancied going between the two engines when one or both were running.


Duncan,
They were fitted into a former American Higgins PT boat, although I never saw the engine I was told that the Centre engine (which was fitted further Aft, this part of the Hull had gone) was one of the Packards.


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## Varley

Duncan112 said:


> Or even Poxford!!


I'd forgotten they had been listening to the Naval Arcs and produced a medium speed crap heap too. Never saw one.


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## Varley

I relied on the preferences to warn me and always kept a vent open when sitting at the bar. When, perhaps, having indulged too close to the adequate level I would rush off if someone closed the vent!

Duncan, absolutely no need to worry about retrofitting on an SF Self-Igniter. It would have burned down several times before you needed an extra deck compressor so plenty of opportunities to retrofit. We did have one of those de-tuner things, can't remember where, Upper Lakes vessel? I do remember that it was dangerous to run unless properly set up and don't think we ever got round to doing so - anyone?


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## Duncan112

Here you are Dave - never went to sea though http://shipsnostalgia.tv/action/viewvideo/1276/Doxford_Seahorse/

I understand Bank Line were interested in having a couple but were persuaded that the conventional type would be better.


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## Enri

Sailed with a second engineer, known as the many midget, who threaded a heaving line through the arms and legs, filled the body with Dhobi dust, then towed it/them astern for a couple of hours. I don't think it got them any cleaner, but he was known as the manly midget after all.


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## twogrumpy

chadburn said:


> 2G, how's this for lack of headroom!!! Packards removed and those other P engines fitted.


Guess looking on the bright side it would not take long to walk round the job.(Jester)


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## makko

Paxman emergency generators on Blue Flues Super P's - Armour plated bulkhead! Nuff said!


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## Varley

Wow! Like an infant Gotaverken with Parkinson's disease! Even a Pielstick didn't flaunt what bit was about to be flung to the plates.


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## twogrumpy

Ah Pielstick, good example of piston broke, good for refurb?


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## chadburn

twogrumpy said:


> Ah Pielstick, good example of piston broke, good for refurb?


Reminds me of the Pistons on a Villiers 2T which suddenly stopped on me. Managed to dress them up and got rid of the Norman B4 Sports ASAP.


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## Dartskipper

Duncan112 said:


> Here you are Dave - never went to sea though http://shipsnostalgia.tv/action/viewvideo/1276/Doxford_Seahorse/
> 
> I understand Bank Line were interested in having a couple but were persuaded that the conventional type would be better.


Doesn't sound very sweet. Too many erratic noises, sounds like an old Hit and Miss semi diesel industrial engine.


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## Dartskipper

Quote by Varley.
Mind, when I was doing my Chief's ticket there was one lad off one of the ferry companies that swore he used easy start on the Pielsticks - or at least did until the tin fell into the exhaust pipes between the Vee just as the engine caught - saved the job of removing the remaining lagging.[/QUOTE]

Saw a Detroit Diesel service engineer struggling to start a 6.71 after an overhaul. They could be reluctant, so out came two cans of Easy Start, one on each end of the air intake on the blower. We squirted while he turned the motor on the button. Started running, but bounced off the compression stroke and promptly started running in reverse, sucking air in the exhaust and blowing exhaust out of the blower. Lovely clattering sound mixed with colourful expletives, and an engine room full of white smoke. (Ouch)


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## Varley

Sir, you do me wrong. I would never ever have sprayed ether into any orifice of one of Dr. Rudolf's boulder grinders. As has been unkindly pointed out in this thread, that might dirty a leckie's boiler suit.


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## Dartskipper

Varley said:


> Sir, you do me wrong. I would never ever have sprayed ether into any orifice of one of Dr. Rudolf's boulder grinders. As has been unkindly pointed out in this thread, that might dirty a leckie's boiler suit.


 That's Detroit Diesels for you V. I have heard them called the most efficient convertors of fuel into noise ever built.
Regards,

Roy.


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## chadburn

Dartskipper said:


> Quote by Varley.
> Mind, when I was doing my Chief's ticket there was one lad off one of the ferry companies that swore he used easy start on the Pielsticks - or at least did until the tin fell into the exhaust pipes between the Vee just as the engine caught - saved the job of removing the remaining lagging.


Saw a Detroit Diesel service engineer struggling to start a 6.71 after an overhaul. They could be reluctant, so out came two cans of Easy Start, one on each end of the air intake on the blower. We squirted while he turned the motor on the button. Started running, but bounced off the compression stroke and promptly started running in reverse, sucking air in the exhaust and blowing exhaust out of the blower. Lovely clattering sound mixed with colourful expletives, and an engine room full of white smoke. (Ouch)[/QUOTE]
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Roy, the above does not surprise me as a Detroit Agent was taken to Court after flogging 'new' engines and parts that were found to have been re-conditioned. Nice paint jobs though.


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## Dartskipper

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Roy, the above does not surprise me as a Detroit Agent was taken to Court after flogging 'new' engines and parts that were found to have been re-conditioned. Nice paint jobs though.[/QUOTE]

Worse than that Chad, in the 70's, there was a supplier of parts selling cylinder liners made in the Eastern Bloc. They fitted perfectly like genuine GM parts, but they had a fatal flaw around the air inlet ports. They would fail on one of the two rows of holes, dropping the lower section straight onto the crank shaft. End of operations for the day!
No matter how much work you put into the paint job, the Detroit would always blow oil past the air box doors, and drip oil from drain tubes on the bottom corner of the block. The rocker covers also leaked from the quick release holding down screws.
But the howl at full revs sent shivers down your spine. Definitely a love hate relationship with those motors!

Roy.


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## Bill Morrison

I don't know about easy start. I was having a problem starting single cylinder engine on the emergency compressor prior to B.oT. inspection. Off with the air filter waste soaked in paraffin on end of screwdriver burning away, crank over the engine, was to close to they intake and the waste vanished into the cylinder head. Dismantled and removed waste from the valves, back together this time kept burning waste well back it started. Once warmed up it would start easily so come they inspection no problem.


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## Dartskipper

The ex Clyde ferry Leven (Built by Wm Denny) was running as Pride of the Bay from around 1968, still with her original 4 cyl Glennifer engines. These had become rather smoky, so the BoT wanted them properly serviced. After this work, the engineer was struggling to get them started, and the air bottles were very low. The hand pump for filling them was really only a last resort.
So, holding a large brown glass bottle of ether meths in one hand, he went for broke and threw a big splash into the air intake just as the engine tried to fire. This caused a flash back to the bottle, which then described an arc out of the engine room hatch, over the side into the Galmpton Creek mud.
Lucky boy!

Roy.


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## Basil

SM,


> Ah technically speaking, after a long court case, the upper piston was an 'eccentric actuated reciprocating exhaust valve'


Wonderful!
Reminiscent of the James Watt Sun & Planet gear to cir***vent some other guy's patent on the crank as we know it.

I'd never before noticed before that the Sun & Planet gear makes one revolution per stroke unlike the half revolution of a conventional crank.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/7b/Meccano_Sun_&_planet_animation.gif


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## Varley

#50 - INZHENER YERMOSHKIN. I think that must have been Black Sea not Baltic. Knew there was something not quite right.


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## Ian J. Huckin

Clean your boily by hanging it on the end of a rope over the aft end at FSS, two hours would do it.


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## Varley

If your earlier post is accurate then you should be well versed in the attitude of the Federal Sea Scouts to offenses against MARPOL (as enacted in appropriate CFR, of course)


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## spongebob

I recall joining my first ship , Rangitane, in Auckland armed with four pairs of brand new white overalls of Kiwi style with a continuous double ended Zip fastener running from groin to Adam's apple . All my navy blue ex apprentiship boiler suits had be discarded as too scruffy to bring on board.
First day on the plates saw us pulling a unit and needless to say my mates made a meal of getting me down and dirty . By the time we had coasted from Auckland to Lyttelton I had two blackened pairs but after transferring to the job of third freezer for the round voyage to and from the UK I was able to keep the remaining pair Persil white for the duration. Perhaps the cushiest job I ever had.

Bob


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## howardws

The OCL 'Small Bays' had a mat covering the decking in the engine control room - about 40 feet long I would have thought. On an early voyage of Flinders Bay in 1969 one bright spark, when told to clean it, hung it over the stern on a rope for a couple of hours. I happened to be there as he pulled about 4 feet of mat back on board. The look on his face was unforgettable!


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## waitimg for orders

*Wake washing*

After watching the wake with the Fourth one evening during a dirty tea on the poop, we wondered if all that turbulence could be put to good use. So we found a line, looped it through the sleeves of the boiler suit, tied the line to a cleat and threw the boiler suit into the wake. How long for a wash? We thought thirty minutes about right. Finished our tea, pulled in the line... To recover two sleeves. Ah well, it was worth a try!


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## waitimg for orders

*Confused commies*

While on a Baltic product run in the Seventies we got orders for Ventspils. Cue removal of convoy clock, which together with the confidential books went I think to the embassy in Stockholm. We were met outside the port by a Russky escort squadron. Sailing in, the Chief ordered a clean up of the engineers' changing room. All orphan boots, suits, weapons and bottles were ruthlessly collected, put in a cardboard box and heaved over the side. Cue frantic activity from the escorts, they probably thought we were ditching the code books. A cutter pulled away from the largest warship and headed at a rate of knots to the sinking box. What they thought when they picked it out of the oggin is anyone's guess. I bet someone in the FSB is still working on it. As I was plainly visible in binoculars to anyone on the escort ships I was scared stiff I'd be locked up for insulting the Soviet state on arrival but there was no problem, everyone was too interested in jeans and ballpoint pens. I suspect our old stuff was probably better then their new stuff so it probably got a new owner pdq.


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