# Help ID this Fixture on Side of Ship Used in Cargo Ops



## captainsimos (Nov 4, 2010)

*First thanks to everyone who helped in identifying which Monterey this ship was (Ward Line)
Next I have two photos of this ship taken at different times showing a large fixture hanging over the side. It was used in cargo operations, but I have no idea what it was used for. One photo shows it on the port side and the other photo shows it on the starboard side. I also have a photo of the ship at sea and the fixture does not appear in that picture. If anyone has any knowledge or suggestions of what it was used for I would appreciate the information. 
*


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## Laurie Ridyard (Apr 16, 2014)

The pictures are not very clear.

Laurie.


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## tsell (Apr 29, 2008)

This is quite intriguing, Captain. At first look, in the first two pics the contraption - for want of a better word - appears to be hanging over the side. However, on enlargement, it appears that it could also be projecting from the side, as from a well deck. Unlikely, though.
I note that there are two sections removed from the rails, one placed forward - above the name - and the other, oddly, apparently attached to the subject.
I hope someone can supply the answer.

Taff


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## A.D.FROST (Sep 1, 2008)

Possibly she had no hatch covers and this was another way of loading


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## Frank P (Mar 13, 2005)

If you look at the 4th photo there appear to be doors at the side of the contraption so when the doors are opened it slides out to do its work.....


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## Aberdonian (Apr 7, 2011)

Could this be an arrangement for walking livestock onboard/ashore?

Keith


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## david freeman (Jan 26, 2006)

Noted this ship had heavy lift derricks. The device is both port and statboard of the Fore mast heavy lift derricks. Noted no dockside cranes-heavy crates on quayside.
Problem is this a temporary landing stage at taff rail/main deck height to reduce the tipping moments when engaged in a heavy lift, so reducing the metacentric height, making the operation within the stability calculations of and the ship. Ward Line according to Wickieleaks trades until 1954 US to Caribbean and Cuba. Cigars, and coffee may not have required Heavy lift gear, but the lack of port facilities may have required such topping out derricks with heavy lifting capabilities


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## Boatman25 (May 17, 2010)

Monterey

Built by W. Cramp & Sons Co., Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, 1901. 4,702 gross tons; 341 (bp) feet long; 47 feet wide. Steam triple expansion engines, twin screw + service speed 16 knots 

Built for New York & Cuba Mail Steamship Co., and New York-Vera Cruz-Progreso-Havana via Ward Line service


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## Mad Landsman (Dec 1, 2005)

Having looked at the pix, my opinion, for what it's worth: 

There are (or appear to be) doors in the side of the ship. The doors are all hinged on the same side - forward on the starboard, aft on the Port. 
The doors are in two levels, presumably for many reasons - Handling is easier; only one level needs to opened if required; to account for curvature of the ship side. 
There are eight openings altogether - Two forward, two aft, on both sides. 
What one sees within the ship is the additional strengthening required for the deck above, together with the masts and lifting gear. 
The doors are strong enough to form part of the ship's hull when at sea - Shell doors which would not therefore be visible at those times. 

The purpose of building a ship in this manner was followed much later in small vehicle ferries and these may have a similar function appropriate to the time. 
Perhaps to facilitate loading something to the upper part of the hold without having to lift it too far - To swing it directly in or out, with very little lifting, just luffing. 
Maybe, as Aberdonian says, it was built to facilitate loading livestock. That also would be logical.


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## Satanic Mechanic (Feb 23, 2009)

They look like doors in the ship side - I wonder if it might be to facilitate the lifting of tall hold cargo.

Edit - sorry madlandsman beat me to it


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## Dickyboy (May 18, 2009)

To allow something taller than the usual height of the derricks lift to be loaded. I'm thinking of something like a cylindrical tank, or a silo. Something of that sort perhaps.


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## John Rogers (May 11, 2004)

As Aberdonia mentioned they could be for the transportation of animals, a safe way where they cant run away.


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## Somerton (Oct 24, 2008)

I think the old Belffast to Heysham steamers the Duke of Argyll and the Duke of Lancaster had similar type doors . I think it was to facilitate discharging and loading when it was high water . It was a very long time ago .

Alex C .


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## cueball44 (Feb 15, 2010)

Here is another vessel with the same type of loading/unloading system. "MEXICO".


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## cueball44 (Feb 15, 2010)

Can see them better in this image.


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## Mad Landsman (Dec 1, 2005)

'Mexico' pix shows it more clearly that there are actually four doors to each opening.
Looking back at Monterey I can now see that is exactly the same - So I got that part wrong... 
By the names - both the same class? Were there others perhaps?


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## Michael Taylor (Aug 31, 2008)

Perhaps an early attempt at "side doors".


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## david freeman (Jan 26, 2006)

well gents? how about the Uk MS ACT 1894 schedule 2 part iii or 1v, as original and for the calculation of tonnage??
I may be as an old BOT surveyor be talking balls! However the doors and proection of the weather deck on this passenger ship of 1911 construction, maybe tied in with this act and its terms of construction. The carrage of livestock and beasts animals is also highlighted in the act for passenger and Immigrant ships: However not being of the time, and not experienced such structures I would be erring on the tonnage measurement requirements, and fees paid, as the shipowner would wish to carry maximum cargo deck and hold, safely for the minimum payment of insurance and port/harbour dues???
The doors are to maintain I respectfully suggest there to increase the vertical height from the main/watertight deck to the weatherdeck, with the minimum of construction. answers on a postcard please??
there is via google a possibility if one wishes to digest SI's and the 1894 act the UK governments web site.


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

I think you have it. Very simple. Raised 'focscle' and 'mast house'.... with solid bulwarks, with 'additional raised upper solid bulwark'. In effect makes a full length shelter deck. 

What to handle any water shipped over the bow?


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## captainsimos (Nov 4, 2010)

*Thanks you eveyone for the ideas on this*

Thanks for everyone that replied to my questions. It does appear to be side doors, although the structure in my picture still seems slightly different.


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## Mad Landsman (Dec 1, 2005)

Where you have the arrow pointing in your second photo is the outer edge of the door, showing the dogs in the frame. The two hinges are to the right.
The shadow of that door is clear on the lower door which is at 90 degrees to the hull. 
Above that, relatively in the picture, you can see the two rear doors of the forward opening. The top one held fast against the hull and the lower one is slightly away from the hull. 
Beyond that again there are the doors for the second opening which are obscured from full view. 

There is no other 'structure' visible, as far as I can see.


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## cueball44 (Feb 15, 2010)

captainsimos said:


> Thanks for everyone that replied to my questions. It does appear to be side doors, although the structure in my picture still seems slightly different.


Optical illusion ?


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