# Cruise Line Proposes 60,000 Passenger Cruise Ship Nearly One Mile Long



## Geoff Gower

Freedom Cruise Line International is proposing the largest vessel in maritime history. It will be 4,500 feet long, as wide as 2 1/2 football fields, and 350 feet high. The ship will be the first mobile City at Sea and carry the name Freedom Ship. The cost to build Freedom Ship? $11 Billion.The 20+ story superstructure would contain condominium housing for 60,000, a hospital, schools, hotel, casino, duty free shopping, and commercial and office occupancies.
The commercial district aboard Freedom Ship will sustain a population of 100,000 people comprised of 40,000 residents, 20,000 full time crew, 30,000 daily visitors, and 10,000 overnight guests to the hotel and casino.


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## CliveH

Not so much a ship, more a floating island.


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## Erimus

Where do you anchor such a beast.....? and is there room for the flying pigs?

geoff


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## Barrie Youde

No doubt eyebrows were also raised when the plans for the Great Eastern were published.

If somebody can dream up the economics, there will be somebody else who will try to make it work.

Do I wish it success? Certainly not until I know more about it!


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## ART6

Where could such a ship ever dock, or would it forever have to anchor off to take supplies or let passengers ashore (if they ever could be bothered)? What sort of anchor would hold such a ship? Like those used on oil rigs that need support vessels to place them? The command "Drop anchor!" could take days to comply with.

What happens when the ship needs a refit? Where in the world could a nearly a mile long ship be docked? A mile long dry dock? Perhaps it doesn't ever need a refit because modern technology that we all love and respect has made that unnecessary, and the hull is impervious to marine growth.

How to maneuver such a ship when the extremities can only be seen through binoculars, and then only in clear weather. What about the windage on such a massive superstructure that would take a fleet of heavy tugs to control? How to get all of those thousands of passengers replete with gourmet dinners out of their cabins and casinos and into lifeboats if the damned thing decides to sink, as ships have been known to do?

Why even bother with such outlandish ideas when, for a fraction of the cost a city of luxury apartments could be built, each apartment equipped with virtual reality systems that would permit residents to visit and experience exotic places without fear of bad weather or sinking? (K)


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## Ron Stringer

The immediate question that comes to mind is "Why?". What is wrong with terra firma as a site for buildings and communities? Ships are intended to transport people and goods from one place to another, a service that terra firma cannot provide.


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## Barrie Youde

#6 

Commercial expectation can be the only answer to the question "why".

Of great expectations are disappointments born.

We shall see.


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## YM-Mundrabilla

I am glad that the dimensions are to be in 'football fields'. Clearly it is to be a precision vessel.

I wonder too how many Eiffel Towers of steel will be required, how many double decker busses will fit in the funnel, how many jumbo jets will be needed to power the beast and how many Olympic swimming pools it will displace. 

The lifeboats will be counted in Titanics.


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## G0SLP

It sounds like something that would be found in a Clive Cussler novel plotline. Oh, hang on, there was one such beastie in one of his offerings...


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## duquesa

*Cruise line Proposes 60,000 Passenger cruise ship*

Before getting excited about the prospect of this "thing" appearing at the breakwater, it might pay to re read the initial media report and look at the final paragraph. The chances of it ever getting off the drawing board are less than winning a major lottery. Pie in the sky.


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## Rob Pithers

If it is to get 30,000 daily visitors and 10,000 'overnight guests, I suspect the intention is for it to go nowhere. What would be the costs of planning etc to build the same on land? Could it be cheaper to build a 'ship' or maybe a barge and permanently moor it somewhere? Maybe no rates?
Rob


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## Barrie Youde

The same blurb indicates an intention to visit different places around the world.


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## Laurie Ridyard

My question is - Who would want to go on such a monstrosity ?

Fred Olsen cruise liners are big enough for me !!!

ATB

Laurie.


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## Barrie Youde

There is much irony in the name Freedom!


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## Stephen J. Card

Rob Pithers said:


> If it is to get 30,000 daily visitors and 10,000 'overnight guests, I suspect the intention is for it to go nowhere. What would be the costs of planning etc to build the same on land? Could it be cheaper to build a 'ship' or maybe a barge and permanently moor it somewhere? Maybe no rates?
> Rob




Ten miles off shore.... NO TAXES!!! 

How long will it take to physically MOVE 30,000 people to and from the ship? 30,000 to go through security? What about the 15,000 'crew'? What even you decide to 'live' on board, how do you go to work? Worst commuter run in the world! I would not even want to come for a visit!

Stephen


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## majoco

Totally impractical surely - how do you feed 100,000 people, how do you get the food, the beer and the fuel to the ship, moored or otherwise. Would you want to be moored in the North Sea in a howling gale - perhaps the Great Southern Bight off Australia with those long swells, the middle of the Pacific doldrums with nowhere to go - I'm sure Rarotonga would love 100,000 tourists but not all in one go. Anyway, how wide is 2½ football pitches?


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## YM-Mundrabilla

'Anyway, how wide is 2½ football pitches?'

It is a combination of an unspecified number of Eiffel Towers, Statues of Liberty, double decker busses and one jumbo jet.
EDIT: I forgot to add in the piece of string.


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## bobharrison2002

Hmmmm-- it's only the 28th today....


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## TommyRob

.....or the old adage there's no such thing as bad publicity?


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## Geoff Medhurst

I suspect that the Chinese will build it and anchor it in the South China Sea.


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## Tony Crompton

bobharrison2002 said:


> Hmmmm-- it's only the 28th today....



Yes, 4 days to April 1st !!


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## BillH

Would expect a lot of hogging and sagging with such a length, not to mention the hopes, dreams and bursting bubbles

Would expect banks aboard so would they handle the "offshore accounts"

Seriously though; was this fantasy not talked about in the media some time ago, supposedly proposed by some or other multi-millionaire, but not in such a grand scale as this


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## Old Se Dog

*freedom ship - an artist impression*

awhile back - and i mean awhile back - their was a plan floated on a discovery? channel on dstv of just such a ship - so this is not new news
the attached images are a concept of the freedom ship - for the record - all comments above are taken into account - i think the idea is ludicrous !


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## BillH

Where would you find a building dock or dry-dock to take such a thing? FANTASY ISLAND would be a more appropriate name, methinks.


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## John Rogers

Reading into the specs I think it will be more like a floating apartment complex.
Senior living Village like in Florida.


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## spongebob

It could be the answer to land shortages , no lawns to mow , no gardens to weed!
Reminds me of my reading some time ago that there are boating marinas in California that moor elaborate yachts of extreme styles , Sky reaching rigging , and all the nautical adornments imaginable that are never intended to put to sea.
They are all show with the upper works built on flat bottom barge hulls and intended for entertainment , gin and tonics , etc without setting sail.

Bob


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## Ron Stringer

spongebob said:


> It could be the answer to land shortages , no lawns to mow , no gardens to weed!


Bob, I think most former deck apprentices would prefer garden maintenance to the sort of things that that the mate had them working on in order the keep the appearance of the ship up to his chosen standard. Better the lawn mower and the weed-killer than the windy-hammer and the Stockholm tar!


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## Dartskipper

It could be built, using modules constructed in different yards, and assembled wherever there is enough empty space to build the dock required. The technology is available in theory, but this is one of those classic cases of not doing something just because you can.


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## Varley

spongebob said:


> It could be the answer to land shortages , no lawns to mow , no gardens to weed!
> Reminds me of my reading some time ago that there are boating marinas in California that moor elaborate yachts of extreme styles , Sky reaching rigging , and all the nautical adornments imaginable that are never intended to put to sea.
> They are all show with the upper works built on flat bottom barge hulls and intended for entertainment , gin and tonics , etc without setting sail.
> 
> Bob


Do they need a Super/Leckie/ECO/ETO/Sparkie/Cabin-boy? My rates are reasonable.


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## Barrie Youde

#29 

How very sensible, David, that you would require payment to go near such a thing.

Most of us would share that view!


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## Varley

The gin might counter the boredom and, depending on the rate, it would be easier enough to pay one's own fare home (which I should do if forced to take the gin with cu***ber).


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## spongebob

Varley said:


> Do they need a Super/Leckie/ECO/ETO/Sparkie/Cabin-boy? My rates are reasonable.


David , 
If you agree to be the man that adds the bitters to the gin as well ,you have the job.


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## Varley

I can mix a mean pink gin. What now astounds me is that if one orders a pink gin one gets served with a gin (so they say) which just happens to be made pink with whatever 'botanical' they think fit. Providing, that is, it has nothing to do with Angostura. The last one, before I leaned that one has to be more explicit, I am sure was prune, beetroot and tomato.


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## Avraham Ariel

*60,000 pax vessel*

I can't comment about gin as I am a cognac person, but talking of huge cruise vessels, it came up already over 20 years ago. At that time the project (con job if you ask me) was called Freedom Ship and it offered tax-free environment. See :
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_Ship
and much more in google. 
A friend of mine put in $1000 as "registration fee" or whatever it was called. He passed away since and his children are still awaiting invitation to the launching of the vessel.


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## Varley

I have had Israeli 'cognac' Avraham while three years on the Kharg Island Eilat run. You would be better on gin unless in the furniture trade, even the prune, beetroot and tomato stuff.


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## Avraham Ariel

*Cognac*

Cognac is French, as you know, and my favourite brand is Remy Martin. There's no Israeli cognac. There's Israeli "brandy", which Moses took a bottle of to Pharaoh, when the negotiations of the "Let my people go" deal were stalled. After tasting that suspicious liquid, the mighty Ramsess II ordered : You drink it! Go! Take your people and never come back! It took Moses 40 years to recover from the effects of that particular bottle.


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## Farmer John

As it aged it could be converted to a prison hulk.


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## jimg0nxx

Avraham Ariel said:


> Cognac is French, as you know, and my favourite brand is Remy Martin. There's no Israeli cognac. There's Israeli "brandy", which Moses took a bottle of to Pharaoh, when the negotiations of the "Let my people go" deal were stalled. After tasting that suspicious liquid, the mighty Ramsess II ordered : You drink it! Go! Take your people and never come back! It took Moses 40 years to recover from the effects of that particular bottle.


(Applause)(Applause)
Excellent answer Avraham! Could not stop laughing.


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## Varley

Was that a sort o0f Jewish Brexit do you suppose? I have tasted both German and Spanish 'cognac' (please note the '') - I do not know why that, alone, has not been casus belli in the business.

Mine is Fontvielle with Remy for the Christmas cake. The devil is that I dare not try any other in case it is 'better' and even more expensive. Brandy is rather like processor speed and Windows versions. As soon as you have had the next one 'up' one cannot return to the inferior.


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## Ron Stringer

Varley said:


> Was that a sort o0f Jewish Brexit do you suppose? I have tasted both German and Spanish 'cognac' (please note the '')


The generic term is brandy - cognac is but one variant.

When on holiday in the Pyrenees, when invited by an elderly waiter in a hotel restaurant if I would like to order a 'digestif', I was unwise enough to request a cognac. Cue for puzzled look from aged retainer and a request for an explanation. Having struggled, using long-past memories of school French, to explain the nature of the drink - how it was made, what sort of glass it was served in, when it was drunk, eventually a look of enlightenment crossed the man's face and he said triumphantly, "Ah, monsieur, vous demandez un Armagnac". 

Only at that point did I realise that I was being had, and that my more worldly, senior attendant was delivering both a take-down and a blow for regional independence. The Armagnac that he brought was as good as any brandy that I have ever tasted and there was no extra charge for the lesson. 

Regardless of the Macons, Mays, Merkels and other politicians, there is no way that Frenchmen will ever become citizens of Europe - they will remain true to their _terroir_.

And I wholly support them.


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## Varley

You remind me Ron.

In my boyhood I clearly remember Pa having bought on the BP 'exchange and mart' a case of Armagnac and offering it a a true treat to his friends after dinner.

When the Wine Cellar did not have any Fontvielle I, under advisement, got a bottle of Armagnac for about the same price.

It was disappointing and when discussing this at a later visit receved the opinion that to have one as good as the Fontvielle one would be paying about double the price of Cognac.


How was it the BP treasure had been so good then I asked myself (Pa would not have paid over the odds, or perhaps even approaching the odds!) and then, in an instant knew my error. It probably wasn't.


Latterly he had been enjoying a particular decorators spirit called Grand Emperor. I do not know any Empire with a throne to which even a Michelangelo could aspire however Grand a dauber he were to be unless already Royal born. And employing Grande Emperor for anything but removing coatings, or perhaps unblocking a rancid scupper would have been a recipe for disappointment.


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## Avraham Ariel

*The best Biblical wine story*

For the best Biblical wine story, which happened about 4000 years ago, that is ca. 700 years before Moses, I suggest you refer to Genesis, chapter 19, verses 33 to 38.
I can't say it was Cognac, Armangac or simple Fire Water.
It did the job, though.
Le'chaim, Salud, Cin-Cin. Skal, etc... amigos!!!


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## Varley

Avraham, That is the sort of behaviour is no longer considered altogether polite in today's politically correct society (and on this particular issue I am with them!)


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## tugger

Looking at those pics; if no one wants to board maybe they could use it a sheep transport from Aus, would keep the middle East fed until the end of time.
Come to think of it it looks like a sheep transport.
Tugger


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## Barrie Youde

#42 

Far better, surely, is the story of the Wedding at Caana in Galilee?

Holy Father, Lord Divine,
Who turned the Water into Wine,
Forgive them, all those foolish men,
Who'd try to turn it back again.


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## Varley

Barrie! Wrong testament I suggest. Avraham is probably still waiting.

(Which reminds me of a good Jewish joke. The village lookout's payrise?)

I have never been sure whether it is polite to wish Happy Passover. Let us just say that I hope he weathers the forthcoming moveable feast, one we share, peacefully.


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## Barrie Youde

#46 

Amen to all of that!

Surely "Biblical" includes both Testaments (whether bibulous or otherwise)?


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## Varley

Well. Would the Scot or Yorkshireman (or those like me with the mixed blood of those generous ancestors) buy a bible including books in which his church did not believe? I know the Torah entertains Great Expectations of the Messiah but it does not admit stories of him written 'in advance'. I have only read extracts from the Book of Mormon on line rather than as an addendum to His Late Majesty's Authorised fairy tale (although having seen the West End version of it last March it's inclusion as the light relief might be appropriate). No. It would be more expensive and would be less environmentally sound. Some would say that it would be sounder to have none of them!)


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## Barrie Youde

#48 

Fair enough!

For sure, I accept that "Biblical" means different things to different people - and that it means nothing to a great many.

To have the globally recognised date recorded in one's own name is no mean feat!


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## fred henderson

It should be noted that this Company does not own or operate any ships. This publicity exercise seems to be aimed at raising capital outside the usual regulated stock exchanges and markets. There are a number of contradictory statements scattered throughout its website. For example: -

1: It calls itself Freedom Cruise Ship International

2: Elsewhere it states that will not be a ship, but a flat bottom barge with a high-rise block on top

3: It will not carry out cruises, but will circle the globe to enjoy the best weather throughout the year. The site shows the projected route includes going around Cape Horn. Good luck with that one!

4: An Indian Company has been appointed as project architects.

5: Elsewhere naval architects, shipbuilders, equipment manufacturers and suppliers are invited to join the project. They will not be paid, but will receive free shares in the company in exchange for their services!

I do not think it will happen in the lifetime of any of our Members.


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## seaman38

Barrie Youde;2978483 whether bibulous or otherwise?[/QUOTE said:


> Isn't that some kind of a bow on a ship?


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## Barrie Youde

Ho! Ho!


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## KEITHMAR

100,000, Old Folks in Florida all banging into each other with Their Zimmer frames ?? The mind boggles . But as Barrie says if the bean counters say"Theres a profit" it COULD get built, Maybe NOT for World cruising, ......... BUT?? suppose They build 500 mts in a dry dock Float 480mtrs out to sea, seal that 20 mtrs bit back into the dock then build build another 500 , join the two bits together, and float that out, and carry on like that ..... OR SOMETHING???........Remember , They sent a man to the moon(DID THEY?)and drilled a big tunnel under the Channel(THAT ;YES!)......SO??


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## Avraham Ariel

*Passover and Easter*

Varley,
Sorry for my belated reply, as I was traveling to The New World to spend Passover with my daughter, who, BTW was co-author of our book "Plotting the Globe" (see https://www.amazon.com/Plotting-Globe-Meridians-International-Explorations/dp/0275988953).
Tks for Passover greetings and I reciprocate with same for Easter to you and all readers.
As you may recall, The Last Supper was Jesus' Passover meal and - what a coincident - both holidays will occur this year on Friday 19 April.
Shalom!


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## Varley

Avraham, Enjoy the holiday. David V


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## Barrie Youde

#54 

Thank you, Avraham, for your greetings to us all at Easter!

My own recollections of Easter in my childhood are that everything went into virtual lock-down on Good Friday and Saturday, too. Easter Sunday was of course a major Church festival (whatever has become of Easter bonnets?), but no real fun of any kind was permitted until Easter Monday. Even the idea of wishing anybody a "Happy Easter" seemed unusual. 

Today in my own family, happily it is a time of major gathering together.

Greetings to all!


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## Varley

Indeed. Pa always referred to Good Friday as the bloodiest day in the year. No Newspapers, no racing and 'Sunday opening'.

I did make S&K Pudding for the multitude last year - to an occasionally Roman Catholic family (their well do***ented family history has been 'flexible', marching between Abbey and Cathedral behind the Monarch of the day). It was a parsimoniously enjoyed meal. This year I will keep to the rules and break the fast on Sunday.

In responding to the admonishment of a younger friend (who is not beyond ribbing me over age) for a dinner invitation in Lent I learned from the web that having passed my 59th Birthday I was excused the Lenten Fast, that he was at liberty to eat seafood or, indeed beaver. As the invitation was for Bentley's the former would be in good supply but I could not answer for the latter. When age has the advantage, let 'em have it with both barrels!


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## Burntisland

I agree. This sounds ridiculous on many levels.


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