# unknown ship wreck



## fourmaster1250

Hello sailing ships community,
again I bought a RPPC showing a ship in distress near the coast. Year and place of the accident is unknown and even the type of ship is not to identify because of the gone rear mast. Ships name and owner - no idea!
Any information will be appreciated!
Reinhard Stadthaus
(fourmaster1250)


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## Stephen J. Card

Good luck with this one!

From at the missing yards and mizzen mast The mizzen mast has gone over. Looks like the topmast is just above the water and you can see the gaff topsail it attached. If so she would be a barque. Yes?

Stephen


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## Alan Rawlinson

fourmaster1250 said:


> Hello sailing ships community,
> again I bought a RPPC showing a ship in distress near the coast. Year and place of the accident is unknown and even the type of ship is not to identify because of the gone rear mast. Ships name and owner - no idea!
> Any information will be appreciated!
> Reinhard Stadthaus
> (fourmaster1250)


Looks suspiciously like the Cornish coast! Will check my file pics and revert


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## fourmaster1250

Yes, it looks like that. And it seems to be an American type of ship.


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## fourmaster1250

Would be great if you find anything amongst your file pics!


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## eddyw

Photographs of shipwrecks in Cornwall were often made by John, Alexander and Herbert Gibson of Scilly, from 1869. It might be one of theirs. The Gibson collection (photos of over 200 wrecks) is held by The National Maritime Museum, Greenwich. You could try there.
https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/...oL73KgiH3bqxw7fF48mhrq5Ulr0Hg/image-asset.png


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## Alan Rawlinson

eddyw said:


> Photographs of shipwrecks in Cornwall were often made by John, Alexander and Herbert Gibson of Scilly, from 1869. It might be one of theirs. The Gibson collection (photos of over 200 wrecks) is held by The National Maritime Museum, Greenwich. You could try there.
> https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/...oL73KgiH3bqxw7fF48mhrq5Ulr0Hg/image-asset.png


First thing I checked, but not there.... Will keep searching


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## stein

I have leafed trough every page of my five books on shipwrecks and now given up the search, but am not sure that Eddyw is right about where she was built. That bow looks to me like what MacGregor calls an Aberdeen bow, and those dark vertical stripes along the long deckhouse also looks British to me. (And that opinion still stands if it is the inside of the outer bulwark we are seeing.) I have never seen that sort of paint decoration in a picture of an American ship...Writing this I am beginning to convince myself, and in a few moments I may be willing to say that her overall looks are much more Aberdeen than East Boston as well. But maybe I will wait with this - that Eddyw fellow are susceptible to drag her name seemingly out of pure darkness. And that would then be "General John B. Something" out of Portsmouth, New Hampshire, I am sure. (==D)


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## eddyw

Afraid I have absolutely no clue where she was built, Stein. Clear though that the reverse process is taking place. The bulwarks aft have been destroyed and what could be interpreted as the 'vertical stripes along the long deck house' amidships seems to me to be the daylight showing through frames and rail where the bulwark planking has been washed away. Its the sort of photo the Gibsons might have taken often commissioned by the local Lloyds agent to provide evidence for the claim against the insurers. But Alan says not one of theirs so ......?


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## Strickylad44

eddyw said:


> Afraid I have absolutely no clue where she was built, Stein. Clear though that the reverse process is taking place. The bulwarks aft have been destroyed and what could be interpreted as the 'vertical stripes along the long deck house' amidships seems to me to be the daylight showing through frames and rail where the bulwark planking has been washed away. Its the sort of photo the Gibsons might have taken often commissioned by the local Lloyds agent to provide evidence for the claim against the insurers. But Alan says not one of theirs so ......?


 I noticed the daylight showing through when I enlarged the image. Could it be an image taken a lot later than one that is already available when you search. There was one that looked very similar. Will go back and take an image of it.


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## Strickylad44

Strickylad44 said:


> I noticed the daylight showing through when I enlarged the image. Could it be an image taken a lot later than one that is already available when you search. There was one that looked very similar. Will go back and take an image of it.


After looking again, I don't think it is. I'm done searching for it.


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## stein

eddyw said:


> Afraid I have absolutely no clue where she was built, Stein. Clear though that the reverse process is taking place. The bulwarks aft have been destroyed and what could be interpreted as the 'vertical stripes along the long deck house' amidships seems to me to be the daylight showing through frames and rail where the bulwark planking has been washed away. Its the sort of photo the Gibsons might have taken often commissioned by the local Lloyds agent to provide evidence for the claim against the insurers. But Alan says not one of theirs so ......?


 No, it was not you that supposed her to be American. I am sorry, might be early onset dementia... Yes, when you say so I can see it is planking that are missing and not differently coloured paint. Looking at a lot of shipwrecks though, I find it strange that the sails should be so intact with the punishmentt the hull has taken. Most stranded wrecks photographed I have looked at today have the sails ripped to shreds.

4 pages of the Gibson collection here: https://images.rmg.co.uk/?service=s...ry=&set=173&qw=&page=3&grid_layout=4&ref=news No ship that fits, but interesting photographs.


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## eddyw

Yes, sails intact and she is carrying a lot of them for stormy conditions. Evident efforts to reduce sail before abandonment. Possibly she went aground in calm(ish) weather, perhaps poor visibility (night time or fog?) Could be hard aground, filling with the tide, damage being caused by wave action at high water?


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## stein

eddyw said:


> Yes, sails intact and she is carrying a lot of them for stormy conditions. Evident efforts to reduce sail before abandonment. Possibly she went aground in calm(ish) weather, perhaps poor visibility (night time or fog?) Could be hard aground, filling with the tide, damage being caused by wave action at high water?


 Sounds like a realistic scenario to me.

The rocky foreground could be nearly everywhere, according to my limited geological knowledge. Not Norway though, the receeding ice of the ice age sanded our coastal rocks and gave them all a quite smooth surface.


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## stein

Not gone any further, but I would like to air the opinion that it may not be a gaff topsail we are seeing furthest aft. A gaff topsail would be fastened with mast hoops at the top half, and have a cut-out below to give place for the doubling. The picture is a good one, I doubt that it has stayed hidden since it was made.


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## fourmaster1250

Thank you all for the interesting information. And even if the ships name still remains in the dark you opened my eyes to see details I didn’t recognize before.
Reinhard Stadthaus
Fourmaster1250


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