# Which Gleniffer ?



## audierne (Sep 20, 2008)

I have had for a great many years a 1/1200th model of Gleniffer.
It is the Mercator 414 model.
So far so good.
These days, I have been doing up Blue Funnel resin models and while looking up rigging arrangements in Blue Funnel Line, (Ships in Focus 1998, by John Clarkson, Bill Harvey and Roy Fenton) I came across the aforesaid name.
The Gleniffer on page 116 was a Liberty ship. No go.
The one on page 51 (ex-Lycaon) looks more promising except that she has a hold between bridge and funnel which the model does not have, apart from other differences. No go
This makes me think that I am (Yet again) barking up the wrong tree.
How many Gleniffers were there? 
Regards,
G.


----------



## cueball44 (Feb 15, 2010)

audierne said:


> I have had for a great many years a 1/1200th model of Gleniffer.
> It is the Mercator 414 model.
> So far so good.
> These days, I have been doing up Blue Funnel resin models and while looking up rigging arrangements in Blue Funnel Line, (Ships in Focus 1998, by John Clarkson, Bill Harvey and Roy Fenton) I came across the aforesaid name.
> ...


Is it this one ? >


----------



## A.D.FROST (Sep 1, 2008)

audierne said:


> I have had for a great many years a 1/1200th model of Gleniffer.
> It is the Mercator 414 model.
> So far so good.
> These days, I have been doing up Blue Funnel resin models and while looking up rigging arrangements in Blue Funnel Line, (Ships in Focus 1998, by John Clarkson, Bill Harvey and Roy Fenton) I came across the aforesaid name.
> ...


Try this one (one above is a Liberty Ship)(Thumb)


----------



## audierne (Sep 20, 2008)

Thanks AD,
That picture looks like LYCAON, op. cit. page 51, and so, no go.
Where to now?
regards,
G.


----------



## audierne (Sep 20, 2008)

My wife, who knows about these technical matters, has been trying to send pictures of the model; Every time, the machine announces that the
"File exceeds the dimensions of the whatsit".
Is my computer at fault ? Or should I send via E-mail to someone who can send it on with a more powerful computer ?
Help definitely wanted !
Regards,
G.


----------



## cueball44 (Feb 15, 2010)

What about this one ? >


----------



## audierne (Sep 20, 2008)

thanks Cueball 44, 
(I have just worked out how to reply.)
The picture is that of a liberty ship as on page 116 of the book I mentioned;
I am beginning to wonder whether the imagination of the model maker did not run away with him.
The model looks very much like a Blue Funnel "A" class, except that it has a pair of derricks immediately in front of the bridge which I cannot find in the photographs.
Artistic licence or did the vessel ship them temporarily at some time ?
Regards, 
G.


----------



## cueball44 (Feb 15, 2010)

This is the Lycaon. She became the Gleniffer in 1951. >


----------



## richardwakeley (Jan 4, 2010)

A-boats did have a pair of derricks on the bridge front, without posts. see photo of Cyclops posted in the gallery by Pat Kennedy.


----------



## audierne (Sep 20, 2008)

Thanks Cueball44, for post N° 6.
This is , I think, most definitely it. A quick look at this ship and Lycaon shows the differences, notably the absence of a hold between bridge and funnel block and the posts on the bridge front, (as distinct from the "A" class arrangement where the derricks seem to have been hinged on the deck and linked (for want of the right word) to a point on the bridge front.)
However, it would appear that we now have three Gleniffers, all illustrated on this page. 
1) The 1913 ex-Lycaon,
2) The 1943 ex Samarkand liberty ship
3) This third one. 
Any ideas ?
As they say, thanks to all for watching.
Regards
G.


----------



## cueball44 (Feb 15, 2010)

In post #8. The Lycaon & Gleniffer are the same vessel.


----------



## audierne (Sep 20, 2008)

More on the "third"one. 
I hope we agree that post 3 & 8 show Lycaon, aka First Gleniffer and post 6 is what I call third Gleniffer. Post 2 shows a Liberty ship, ex-Samarkand, that I call Second Gleniffer.
Very pompous, I used to be a teacher.
I spent a happy morning regretting not having acquired the volume in which Duncan Hawes describes the Glen line. 
Instead, I went to www.red-duster.co.uk/glen9.htm (I hope I got that right=) where I found page 9 a Carnarvonshire which to me looks very much like the Gleniffer I have.
Does anyone have a copy of Duncan Hawes' Glen line to solve the mystery ?
It might mean that Gleniffer was not just a "rename" for Holts but a "name " for Glen line. and so, would have had nowt to do with Blue Funnel. 
Afterthought: Why does she look so much like a Blue Funnel ship ?
Same designers ? Same shipyards ?
Enough for tonight, 
Regards,
G.


----------



## IAN M (Jan 17, 2009)

Copied from GLEN AND SHIRE LINES (MERCHANT FLEETS) by Duncan Haws.

GLENIFFER (II)
As Glengyle except T 9,429g. 6,021n.
1915 June. Completed. War requirements service.
1917 April. Taken over by the Liner Requisition Scheme.
1917 Feb. Made her first Glen sailing to the Far East.
1941 After Japan entered the war used on other routes by the Shipping Controller.
1946 Reverted to Glen and Shire service but she was unable to maintain her schedule alongside the more modern ships.
1947 Broken up in Barrow-in-Furness by Thos. W. Ward. 

(The Glengyle referred to was Glengyle (III) torpedoed on 1st January 1916. Gleniffer (I) was completed in 1877.)


----------



## audierne (Sep 20, 2008)

Thank you all.
Ian's post has, I think, clinched it.
The way I see it now is that we have two series of Gleniffers:

A) Two that have no connection with Holt's.
1) Built 1877, 2,165 t, sold out 1882, lost 1899.
4) Built 1915, 9,429 t, B.U. 1947 (=Photo in post 6)

And two that have a connection:
2) Built 1913 for China Mutual SN Co as Lycaon, approx.7,500 t, transferred to Glen line 1951 as Gleniffer, B.U. 1952 
(Photo in posts 3 & 8 )
3) Built 1943, 7,291 t, to Britain as Samarkand, Acquired 1947 To Ocean S.S. Co as Talthybius,
tranferred to Glen line 1954 as Gleniffer, sold out 1958, B.U. 1971 
(= photo in post 2)

I think the model I have is N°4
Many thanks to everyone for this piece of teamwork. Any other 1/1200 mysteries out there?


----------



## audierne (Sep 20, 2008)

I have just put a photo of the model in the gallery. Had I known how to do it, I would have put it here but there are limits to my electronic know-how !


----------



## audierne (Sep 20, 2008)

very nice of you, it rounds off this thread beautifully.
Thanks,
G.


----------

