# Custom of ship names in big letters on side



## FSG631 (Nov 23, 2006)

Dear All,

I know that in war time, either, WWI and WWII, I have seen mostly neutral ships having huge flags painted on the hull sides, just to be sure that it is noted that they are neutral (except the the odd raider!!!!)

I did come across several pictures showing vessels with their NAME also in big letters on the side, plus the bow, as usual.

I thought it might have been a WWI custom, but it seems some pictures show this prior to 1914 (unless dated wrong). (and post 1918, but that could be a case of not having been painted since!).

Mostly the pictures were of German ships.

My question is, was this a German thing linked to WWI, or was it customary prior to 1914 also on other nation's vessels?

Whatever the reason, why was it introduced and why was it abolished?


Would anybody know?


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## A.D.FROST (Sep 1, 2008)

Lauritzen,DFDS & Maersk seems to have been a Danish thing.


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## FSG631 (Nov 23, 2006)

As I mentioned, I DID SEE IT ON GERMAN SHIPS!

...but then, I was only looking at German ships, but I have seen it on others as well, also Swedish.

Does not solve the question regarding it being a war thing or not!


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## John Rogers (May 11, 2004)

Lykes Line also had the name on the side of the hull.


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## John Rogers (May 11, 2004)

FSG631 said:


> Dear All,
> 
> I know that in war time, either, WWI and WWII, I have seen mostly neutral ships having huge flags painted on the hull sides, just to be sure that it is noted that they are neutral (except the the odd raider)
> 
> ...





I know that in war time, either, WWI and WWII, I have seen mostly neutral ships having huge flags painted on the hull sides, just to be sure that it is noted that they are neutral (except the the odd raider)


Many MN members will not consider the German Raider a laughing matter, many good sailors lost their lives to this type of treachery.


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## stan mayes (Jul 22, 2006)

A few British trampship companies also had the name on ships side.
Sir R.Ropner and Sons - I made a voyage in Ocean Vanity in 1947 managed
by Ropner's..At end of trip the ship was bought from the MOWT by Ropner's
and renamed Teespool..The name was painted on ships side in 5 feet high letters.
I think it was discontinued in 1950.
Stan


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## FSG631 (Nov 23, 2006)

Dear John!

I am sorry! I did not mean to offend anyone, and indeed, the (he he) I could have spared! Thanks for the bell you rang!

War is a dirty business, was and always will be, especially if it comes to non-combatant,s if you want to include the MN in that category!

My wife's great uncle lost his life on the HMS RAWALPINDI in November 1939! At the same time, my old teacher of math at primary school in Germany served as a seaman on the SCHARNHORST, which sank her! (and my wife's Grandfather was a Navigator in Bomber Command of the RAF and I have his flight records and maps, showing he was over Hamburg, where we live, but did not land!!!)

If there is one thing which life at sea taught me for life, it is the respect for other cultures and the need to stay beside each other in time of peril and if it comes to assistance of fellow seamen in distress! I am glad, that I was not asked to fight in my life, especially at sea!

And I am heavily in love with my wife, the former "enemy"!

NO need to make fun! I am sorry for that!

The fact remains, German Raiders DID paint wrong names on the side in disguise! This I brought up, as I thought it was a "neutral" custom, but I noticed it on MANY ordinary German ships.

The question remains, was it a war thing?


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## Scatari (May 19, 2012)

John Rogers said:


> I know that in war time, either, WWI and WWII, I have seen mostly neutral ships having huge flags painted on the hull sides, just to be sure that it is noted that they are neutral (except the the odd raider! He he!)
> 
> 
> Many MN members will not consider the German Raider a laughing matter, many good sailors lost their lives to *this type of treachery.*


John:

With all due respect, I don't agree that disguising one's ship is in any way an act of "*treachery*."

It is a legitimate "ruse de guerre" which has been used by many navies for centuries ... not sure what the rules are today but in the past, such disguise was considered quite legitimate as long as one's true colours (flag) were run up prior to opening fire.

One of the most recent examples of this practice was the RN "Q-ships" in WWI, which masqueraded as innocent merchant ships until an unsuspecting U-boat surfaced to attack or investigate.

An unfortunate practice for the victims undoubtedly, but not "treachery" I would submit.


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## John Rogers (May 11, 2004)

Apology excepted. I to married a former enemy and loving every 57 years of it,she is from Oberammagau (The Garden of Germany) and we were married in Munchen, my favorite city, and I visit often. I also have fond memories of Hamburg as I was first there in 1947,St Pauli was going strong. Back to your question which was a good one. You can remove the He! He! by doing an edit if you care to.
By the way I have almost every book written about the German Raiders.


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## John Rogers (May 11, 2004)

Scatari said:


> John:
> 
> With all due respect, I don't agree that disguising one's ship is in any way an act of "*treachery*."
> 
> ...


Not all of the Raiders Captains were gentlemen and played by the rules, some acted under their own rules and committed murder.


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## FSG631 (Nov 23, 2006)

SIR!

Done, SIR!

...could we revert to the core of the query now?

Why? When? (emphasis pre 1914, or in between 1919/39)


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## John Rogers (May 11, 2004)

Scatari said:


> John:
> 
> With all due respect, I don't agree that disguising one's ship is in any way an act of "*treachery*."
> 
> ...


A better choice of word would have been DECEIT.(Thumb)


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## Scatari (May 19, 2012)

John Rogers said:


> A better choice of word would have been *DECEIT*.(Thumb)


Agreed 100% John - the perfect word!


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## John Rogers (May 11, 2004)

Scatari said:


> Agreed 100% John - the perfect word!


Based on that we can now try to find the answers to Lars question.

John.


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## FSG631 (Nov 23, 2006)

Example (undated):


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## lakercapt (Jul 19, 2005)

*Ships side names*



stan mayes said:


> A few British trampship companies also had the name on ships side.
> Sir R.Ropner and Sons - I made a voyage in Ocean Vanity in 1947 managed
> by Ropner's..At end of trip the ship was bought from the MOWT by Ropner's
> and renamed Teespool..The name was painted on ships side in 5 feet high letters.
> ...


Cheers Stan
Yes you are correct Ropners had the name painted on the ships side.
I remember doing it on the staging for the "Firby" in 1956 but believe it was discontinued after that. A lot of work for little results. On the later ships I was on it was only the "Ingleby" that had it and that was 1967. So long ago!!


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