# Doctor At Sea.



## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

During my ten years deep-sea I was only ever once in a ship that did not carry a ship's doctor. Even in several of the ageing coal burning ships of the Blue Funnel Line there was always a fully qualified doctor; sometimes an elderly retired man, and sometimes a newly qualified one wanting to see a bit of the world before advancement.
One such doctor wrote a book about his voyage in the Polyphemus in 1907: it became a best seller and recognised as a travel classic!
I once took our doctor away in a life-boat to board a tramp ship in the Red Sea to attend an injured seaman. Any other such experiences?
I cannot imagine many cargo/container ships carrying a doctor these days-could it be there were more doctors around in those days!?


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## eriskay (Mar 26, 2006)

Hugh :

Was it not the case that Doctors had to be carried only on vessels carrying passengers (I think a certain number or over) or warships with large crews?


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## sparkie2182 (May 12, 2007)

99 non passengers or fewer onboard did not require a doctor.........100+ did.

11 or less classed as passengers required a doctor......12+ did.

This is stuck in my mind, im sure pompeyfan and others can confirm or refute.


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## jimthehat (Aug 5, 2006)

I always thought that it required 12 or more passengers before a doctor was required.
Only sailed on one ship with a doctor ,isipingo from bank line and you could count the passengers on one hand.

jim


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## holland25 (Nov 21, 2007)

Most of the "doctors" I sailed with in Blue Funnel were male nurses.


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## Ron Stringer (Mar 15, 2005)

Only sailed on 2 ships that carried a doctor; both ships had more than 100 souls on board but neither had more than 99 passengers.

The first doctor I sailed with was very elderly former consultant at a London training hospital, who was always pleased to regale you with stories of how he had trained with/worked with Sir Bernard Spilsbury a famous forensic pathologist. He was charming and amusing and very popular with the passengers. Although somewhat unsteady on his feet and looking somewhat fragile, he showed no hesitation in boarding a lifeboat in mid-Atlantic to be ferried to a Norwegian ore carrier with an allegedly seriously ill crewman. Having climbed the pilot ladder to board her in very rough seas, he found that the man had been dead for 2 or 3 days. He signed a death certificate (it was suspected that was the real reason that the Master had requested a doctor) and made the journey back without problem. Quite a character.

On another ship I sailed with two doctors during my 17 month's stay. The first was an elderly Scotsman who had retired from general practice and was a delight to sail with. He was somewhat absent-minded and once showed me a letter from his wife in which she was complaining that his last letter to her had started ''Dear Sir or Madam'' - she was not amused.

His replacement was a surly Irishman in his early 40s who barely spoke to anyone during the trip and did not mix at all socially. In port he disappeared and only returned each night to sleep. He took most of his meals in his cabin but most of his consumption appeared to be in liquid form, with a high alcoholic content.


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

At least seven of the ships I sailed in did not carry passengers but did have a fully qualified doctor on board. One of those ships I was four voyages in and always with a doctor c.1944/47.

Perhaps this earlier thread on this subject maybe of interest to newer members. Click on:- www.shipsnostalgia.com/showthread.php?t=15759&highlight=Surgeon's


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## eriskay (Mar 26, 2006)

Hugh Ferguson said:


> At least seven of the ships I sailed in did not carry passengers but did have a fully qualified doctor on board. One of those ships I was four voyages in and always with a doctor c.1945/47.
> 
> Perhaps this earlier thread on this subject maybe of interest to newer members. Click on:- www.shipsnostalgia.com/showthread.php?t=15759&highlight=Surgeon's




Fascinating link/thread, Hugh, you have done a lot of work here and it is clear that the events, memories and personalities are something very close to your heart. Thanks for sharing.


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## R58484956 (Apr 19, 2004)

On one ship I was on if you were going to have an accident which needed medical attention, only have it between 09.00 and 19.00 other wise medical attention would have been nil. A coloured drink from Scotland seemed to be in charge the rest of the time.


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## woodend (Nov 23, 2009)

In E.D.'s the Doctors were quite often specialists doing a holiday job. I remember the one eminent surgeon being invited ashore in Lagos on a 'working visit' and performing various operations during our stay.


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## dennyson (Dec 19, 2005)

Last night on the Aussi coast (Melbourne). All passengers embarked including doctor who'd only got married that day - his honeymoon was the trip to UK!
Another cadet and I went ice skating, I came back on board with a very painful and swollen knee, senior cadet called the doc (not a very pleased one!) who diagnosed a broken knee cap, ordered an ambulance and went back to bed!


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## Tom Inglis (May 3, 2007)

In my time in Blue Funnel 1957 to 1968 they carried a Doctor on the H boats [Aussie trade] , The P boats [Far East/Japan] and on the Big Glens. Of course also on Charon & Gorgon on the Singapore-Aussie run and ultimately on the Centaur. All of these ships carried 35 plus passengers. On all others, including the 12 passenger ships, there was a male nurse sometimes doubling up as purser. When I sailed on Glenroy the doctor for three trips was a retired lady doctor. I believe there is still in existence a group of ex Blue Funnel Doctors [in Yorkshire ?] who meet once or twice a year to remember the old days. There can't be many of them left now. Like everything else, when there was an opportunity to reduce costs by eliminating the doctors, nurses and pursers this was done .

Tom Inglis


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## Nick Balls (Apr 5, 2008)

In 37 years I never sailed with a doctor. We used to have around 100 crew on some of the diving vessels off the South American coast and we still only had one person with any half decent qualifications, That was the Master with the trusty old MN Ships Medical. 
Holding an advanced medical aid course I worked on many ships that held the full deep sea medical locker (Cat a to MSN 1768) and was often the one delegated by ISM to be in charge.
What amazes me is :
1) The (New) Medical scales were so inadequate and did not contain much of the modern equipment you really needed. A classic example of this is a Defrib unit which these days even our bin men at home are trained to use !!!!
2) The Replacement for the old Ships Masters Medical is the Advanced Medical Aid course....Very good but two problems , you only need to take it once in 5 years and its short nature means that it is clearly inadequate. 
In recent years (now retired) on a ship new to me,I used to have to spend a couple of weeks working right through these medical lockers to insure that they were properly up to scratch . Modern Ship manning means that these kind of things are often the first to be neglected. I know the 'scales' were changed but they still exclude many things that are standard practice ashore. 
A pretty lethal combination.......... Poor training and inadequate equipment!!
I should say with but few exceptions the vessels I am talking about were British and the rest while not, were working to the same regulations.


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## Chris Isaac (Jul 29, 2006)

The ShipMaster's Medical Guide was a wonderful book. It could take you through any procedure.
To my amusement the last two chapters were funeral ceremonies, Catholic and Protestant..... just in case!


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

Hugh Ferguson said:


> At least seven of the ships I sailed in did not carry passengers but did have a fully qualified doctor on board. One of those ships I was four voyages in and always with a doctor c.1944/47.
> 
> Perhaps this earlier thread on this subject maybe of interest to newer members. Click on:- www.shipsnostalgia.com/showthread.php?t=15759&highlight=Surgeon's


 In post #13 on the above thread, a member, Hamish Mackintosh, made the offer of a Penguin copy of the book to any member who wished to read it on the undertaking that said person would then be prepared to pass it on to another.
First to take up the offer was Sister Eleff. By now I could imagine the book has been around the world a couple of times. Does anyone know where it is now?


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## R396040 (Sep 30, 2008)

*Medical Service aboard ship*

I seem to recall in my time a ship had to have over 100 souls on board before carrying a doctor. I was at sea 1947 to 1977.
After ten years on varying companies I was promoted Purser/CS on Cunard cargo ships and I was responsible for treatment on board. I did possess a Ships Captains Medical certificate after spending two weeks in the casualty dept of Broad green hospital Liverpool observing & training. I stitched my first wound there,witnessed my first stomach pumping and clearance of a blocked urinary tract (painful to watch ! ) I found it very interesting and gave me great admiration for the Doctors & nurses. Also had several days lectures on many varied medical subjects at Liverpool Polytechic.
At sea I only had one crewmember die, a heart attack in mid Atlantic. On another occassion I nursed a crew member with burst appendix peretonitis for five days before reaching NY receiving medical advise by radio, he was landed at NY and repatriated. I always remember my first injection for a sicial disease, no throwaway syringes in those days just a large glass syringe and huge needle which needed steralising in a small ss dish heated with spirit. After giving the injection looked down at mans buttocks to see the needle still in sperated from syringe, quickly covered up whilst swabbing affected area. Fight in crew bar with one man hit over head with bottle requiring several stitches. I had removed patient to my cabin to stitch him up and was in the process when his mate who had hit him came up to apologise and shake hands. My patient agreed but when his mate came close grabbed by medical scissors and tried to stab him. I had needle & threat in his scalp at time and had to fall on him to stop further damage. Happy days....
Still got the ships Captains Medical Guide too and bring it out occassionally. Made a wrong diagnosis for my grandson, he didnt have measles but then again skilled Doctors were close at hand here so par problem as they say
Stuart H


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## Dave Woods (Apr 9, 2006)

I sailed with quite a few over the years with Cable and Wireless on the Cable Layers. The resident on the “Venture” was a nice old gentleman who resided on a small Island off Singapore when on leave. During his time on board he collected all the out of date medication and ran an unofficial surgery on the Island, the authorities turning a blind eye to his activities. He suffered from Alopecia and wore a wig which over the years the colour did not follow his advancing years. The story goes that one night at sea the fire alarm went off and he was rushing along the boat deck trying to adjust the wig however it was not attached as it should have been, (some stories say it was on backwards). A gust of wind got under the maladjusted hairpiece and sent it flying, landing at the feet of an engineer who promptly stood on it with a size 10 engine boot covered in oil.
Another notable one was on Mercury; a doctor from Nigeria was put on board during a lay in the Caribbean. For the first couple of weeks we did not see a lot of him however one evening he located the bar and found out he had a liking for “Scottish sauce”. After that he would leave the bar holding the hand rail, unfortunately this went in the opposite direction to his cabin, however he would follow it all the way aft before crossing over at the end of the alleyway and then follow the other side back to his cabin at the fore end of the ship. 
On Innovator we had an Australian who resided in South Africa and had answered an advert on the internet. He wanted to go to sea to learn a little navigation as he wanted to compete in the rowing race from the Canaries across the Atlantic. Towards the end of the voyage after the lay was completed we had a bar quiz, strangely he got every medical question wrong!


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## Ian6 (Feb 1, 2006)

I believe the 'maximum 12 passengers' related to defining the ship as a cargo ship rather than a passenger ship (with correspondingly more stringent rules) the 'do or don't need a doctor' break point was 100. It was symptomatic of those, better but less competitive days, that several of P&O's ships carried doctors only because they carried doctors. The sawbones was the 100th person (or 101, I'm not sure) but without him we were below the break point.
One trip in the 'Sunda' (sadly now more than 50 years ago) we carried a doctor on the Far East run whose sister lived in Singapore. Homeward bound our passenger list (upto 12) included a Dr someone so the ship's doc arranged to leave in Singapore and rejoin in Penang, days later. The Captain was saddened to find the passenger Dr was a Phd in philosophy rather than the bloodier pastimes. In fact it didn't much matter that we were doc-less, legally, although it depleted our drinking circle, since we almost never had all 12 passengers aboard.
Ian


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## Union Jack (Jul 22, 2009)

*A coloured drink from Scotland seemed to be in charge the rest of the time*

R58484956 - That's no way to speak about Irn-Bru!(Thumb) 

Jack


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## Sister Eleff (Nov 28, 2006)

Chris Isaac said:


> The ShipMaster's Medical Guide was a wonderful book. It could take you through any procedure.
> To my amusement the last two chapters were funeral ceremonies, Catholic and Protestant..... just in case!


... if all else fails try this (the last two chapters) (EEK)


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## Sister Eleff (Nov 28, 2006)

Hugh Ferguson said:


> In post #13 on the above thread, a member, Hamish Mackintosh, made the offer of a Penguin copy of the book to any member who wished to read it on the undertaking that said person would then be prepared to pass it on to another.
> First to take up the offer was Sister Eleff. By now I could imagine the book has been around the world a couple of times. Does anyone know where it is now?


Some pal you are Hugh! I was keeping quiet about the book, Hamish did indeed send it to me promptly. I read it at the time and have been meaning to re-read it. As no one contacted me about the book, I still have it safely. Looks as if I will have to start reading again before the requests come in!


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## trotterdotpom (Apr 29, 2005)

Doctors must have been a rouble a dozen in Eastern Bloc countries because, reputedly, lots of ships had them.

Here's a story taken from Ray Richardson's "Sidewinder" site some time ago - the site is currently under renovation and a lot of previous content has disappeared:

In 1964, the Grimsby trawler, Ross Fighter was fishing at Newfoundland when two men were injured. The Doctor from an East German trawler in the area was dispatched to help. When he got aboard the Fighter, he sent the two injured men back to his own ship, but refused to leave himself! The injured men were eventually transferred to a West German trawler and landed in St Johns. The doctor stayed aboard Ross Fighter and was eventually taken to Grimsby about a month later. Wonder if he honed his surgical skills with a gutting knife? Presume he was eventually went to West Germany - anybody know?

John T.


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## Sister Eleff (Nov 28, 2006)

Great story TDP and by the way the book is yours, no one else has contacted me - there had to be one didn't there. Will PM you when sent. If anyone else is interested, contact TDP.


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

Sister Eleff said:


> Some pal you are Hugh! I was keeping quiet about the book, Hamish did indeed send it to me promptly. I read it at the time and have been meaning to re-read it. As no one contacted me about the book, I still have it safely. Looks as if I will have to start reading again before the requests come in!


 Well I'm blowed-there's me thinking Hamish's book must have been around the world a couple of times by now and it's never been out of Sydney!!


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## Dave Woods (Apr 9, 2006)

from Nick Balls
1) The (New) Medical scales were so inadequate and did not contain much of the modern equipment you really needed. A classic example of this is a Defrib unit which these days even our bin men at home are trained to use !!!!
.[/QUOTE said:


> Some years ago I was on a ship where a senior officer had a heart attack and was found when he was called for his watch. The Chief Officer who had been a nurse, tried for a long time to bring him round whilst we tried in vain to get a “medivac” from the nearest country which was all of a couple of miles away although the closest port was 6 hours steaming.
> 
> At the next safety meeting a Defrib unit was requested but was turned down on “Elf and Safety” grounds, as no one was trained to use them. Every argument, all the ships put forward meeting after meeting, to the company was promptly turned down, and this went on for about 10 years; eventually someone in the office started to listen to reason. The ships now have one, kept under lock and key, with strict regulations as to its use and who can operate it.


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

The only occasion I can recall, when we urgently needed expert surgical attention, was in the only ship I ever sailed in that didn't have a doctor!
This happened in an American escorted convoy from which we had become a "straggler" (not so much on account of weather as to poor quality coal).
There had been an accidental shooting amongst the DEMS gunners keeping watch on the poop-a .38 calibre revolver had been accidentally fired by a John Hill, and the bullet had severed an artery in a leg belonging to DEMS gunner William Henry Browning.
Fortunately, we were still in sight of the rear ships in the convoy, but despite all efforts to attract attention by distress rocket, signalling and unendingly blowing the steam whistle, as far as that convoy was concerned we had ceased to exist!
Desperate cir***stances demand desperate measures, the captain decided to break radio silence. That did the trick and it wasn't long before the senior US Navy escorting destoyer was steaming alongside wanting to know what all of the fuss was about.
Despite the heavy swell they did a magnificent job taking the wounded gunner off in a breeches buoy-despite nearly shooting the 3rd mate, Hugh Davies with the first line throwing effort-and gunner Browning R.N. was safely transferred: I do hope he survived his ordeal.
We, in the M.O.W.T. Glen Line managed Empire Capulet survived the night (I remember all hands being ordered to sleep in their clothes) and next day put into Fayal in the Azores until the arrival of an armed trawler, to escort us onwards to off Gibraltar, where we joined another convoy on our way to Bombay.
I still have a vivid image in my mind of gunner John Hill being marched ashore under escort on our arrival there. VE Day was just 3 months away-he had survived all of those desperate days at sea (including just having come from the Normandy landings in the same ship). He had already been with us in the Empire Capulet (why did the U.S. Navy always have to get the name wrong, they insisted on calling us Empire Copulate) for six months. He was a nice guy, a miner in peacetime coming from Aber-Bargoed. I believe he was married during the war to a Scottish girl in Glasgow.
I do so often wonder what became of them all-they surely deserved the best after what they had gone through.


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## teb (May 23, 2008)

Remembering Doctors at sea on Blue Funnel ships brings to my mind one really odd ball Doctor I sailed with .On this particular voyage with Pilgrims from North China to Jeddah our Ships Doctor was not too well himself and did not hold great store in the maxim "Physician Heal Thyself" as the medication which he was taking was supposedly to be kept in a refigerated temperature-but not for our Doc. he kept it in a port hole box in full view of the sun,as a result after taking same he was not well man.The outcome of this somewhat lackadaiscal treatment!!! was when we called at the quarantine port before Jeddah the quarantine Doctor was called upon to treat the ships Doctor. (somewhat embarrasing as it was self inflicted)Really a nice chap though.:sweat: 











p


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## Sister Eleff (Nov 28, 2006)

Hugh Ferguson said:


> Well I'm blowed-there's me thinking Hamish's book must have been around the world a couple of times by now and it's never been out of Sydney!!


Sorry to disappoint you Hugh, but it has been loved and appreciated. It's next trip is to Queensland.


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

My disappointment is that so few members appeared to be wanting to read the book-if nobody else wanted it, what else was there for you to do?


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## Pompeyfan (Aug 9, 2005)

I naturally worked with many doctors on Canberra and Arcadia. And of course in those days we performed post mortems and burials at sea on my hospital deck. The Surgeons were usually either senior consultants either physicians or surgical sometimes retired, sometimes seeking a change. The Surgeon on Canberra when I was aboard was a South African, and friend of Dr Christian Barnard who always visited us when in Cape Town. On Arcadia the Surgeon was a retired army Major General, and Orthopaedic Surgeon, once Orthopaedic Surgeon to The Queen. The Assistant Surgeon known as Baby Doc was usually a doctor who had just finished his or her hospital training spending some time at sea seeing the world before settling shore side. Basically one was ending their career, the other starting it. 

I stood by a few P&O ships in Southampton during refits etc as the only medic on board waiting for the next crew change of my own ship. 

David


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## John Briggs (Feb 12, 2006)

I am surprised that no one has mentioned that wonderful movie "Doctor at Sea", to my mind it was a classic.
The film makers never realised how close to true life they actually came!


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## trotterdotpom (Apr 29, 2005)

Great movie, John. I was in love with Brigitte Bardot at the time and extremely jealous of Dirk Bogarde - turns out the original "sex kitten" was as safe as houses from any advances by Dirk. If only I'd known that at the time - c'est la vie.

John T.


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

That film (sorry, movie) was so long ago that even I had forgotten it. What does that say?! Thanks for your PM John T


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## paullad1984 (Jun 6, 2008)

Does anyone know the ship used in the film?


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## sidsal (Nov 13, 2007)

ss MAIHAR 1943. 1917 built - no running water, no fridges. She had been converted to an oil burner and the redundant coal bunkers made into bunkhouses for Indian crews being repatriated. With our Indian crew and the passengers we were well over a hundred souls so we had a doctor on board. At that time doctors were in short supply and they were scraping the barrel.
Ours was drunken Glaswegian and if you consulted him about anything - say earache, his stock answer was -" Forget it laddie - just ignore it . It'll go away. Here- have a drink"
The longer I live the better I have thought his advice to be. I am convinced that 90% of people turning up at surgeries would get better without treatment. Trouble is sorting out the 10-% who need help.


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## Hank (Jun 28, 2007)

I joined Blue Funnel in 1947. From then until about 1958 every ship I sailed on carried a doctor. After that we carried a male nurse/pursor. So it looks like the doctor was one of the first to go in the economy drive which was getting under way at the time and which was eventually to economise us right out of a merchant navy.
John


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

One of my abiding memories was my second peacetime visit to Singapore. The ship was the somewhat war battered coal-burning Glenfinlas (started life in the Blue Funnel Line in 1917 as the Elpenor and reverting to that name again about 1948).
Singapore in early 1946 could only be described as chaotic-there was a great deal to be done in order to get back to peacetime normality. After discharge of our Singapore cargo somebody realised that this ageing unit of the Blue Funnel Line had once been equiped to carry pilgrims, but all that remained from those days were the rows of dead-lighted port holes lining the centre castle deck. What better way to transport between five hundred and one thousand (no-body counted them) Hong Kong Chinese back to Hong Kong.
In an earlier age they would have been categorised as slaves but during the war they were usually referred to as forced labour. All of them, without exception, were in a very poor state of health, as you may well imagine, after all of the privations they had endured. 
I cannot remember the name of our doctor on that voyage but I do believe he was a young newly qualified man: I don't think he could have reckoned on anything like that for his first trip to the Far East!


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