# Still suffering from the war.



## Stuart Smith (Oct 30, 2004)

I had my old 'plates of meat' looked at yesterday by a chiropodist. We got to chatting about past jobs etc. and when I mentioned the Merchant Service he told me about an old chap of 85 ish that he is treating.
This man was on destroyers and the Russian convoys during the war and happened to get a bad case of frostbite in his feet. The chiropodist man said that he lost some toes and a lot of the flesh from the soles of his feet and that he still has very much pain from the raw nerve ends. Fortunately the treatment is paid for by a Navy veteran association but this does not off-set the discomfort this man is having 60-odd years later.
Let some of todays youngsters put that in their pipe and smoke it. I wish they had some appreciation of how people are still suffering so that we can have a freedom of choice.
Sorry........had to get it off my chest.
Stuart


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## gdynia (Nov 3, 2005)

True words spoken Stuart


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## Noddy-Billing (Nov 6, 2007)

Living in a Naval port, I hear of cases like this often. It is humbling to think that these old guys still get about and rarely grumble. When I read of 'Football Heroes' and the like, I could cry.


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## ssr481 (Feb 2, 2008)

There is a gentleman who volunteers aboard the Liberty Ship SS JOHN W BROWN in Baltimore who has the same ailments...though not as much frostbite. He was on one of the convoys going into Murmansk when his ship was sunk off Norway. He managed to go ashore, was captured by the Germans, sunk off the German ship by the Russians, then picked up again by the Germans then spent the rest of the war in a POW camp. I talk with him whenever I'm on the BROWN... fascinating guy..


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## ddraigmor (Sep 13, 2006)

I am constantly amazed by men like these who don't moan and who don't claim what they are due.

Noddy - you are so right! So called clebraties wo whinhe and gripe about unfair conditions....puts the world into perspective,. doesn't it?

Jonty


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## Chouan (Apr 20, 2006)

"Let some of todays youngsters put that in their pipe and smoke it. I wish they had some appreciation of how people are still suffering so that we can have a freedom of choice.
Sorry........had to get it off my chest."

I understand your feelings. Unfortunately, having that attitude is not going to win them over, its just going to exacerbate the us and them feelings that already exist and alienate us from them, and them from us even more. You can't hector them into understanding the unbeleivable sacrifices that were made, any more than the bloke in question could understand what his father's generation went through in the First World War. 
Its not just our and his generation that they don't understand, or connect with either. One of the Year 9 kids that I teach has a cousin who recently came back from Afghanistan, suffering from what used to be called shell-shock, aged 19. He began shaking and crying in a supermarket and was laughed at by a group of kids. They, of course, had no idea of what he'd seen or gone through, or what was causing his distress. No more idea than they'd have about the pain of the bloke that you describe.

Noddy, your comment "When I read of 'Football Heroes' and the like, I could cry." I also agree with, however, its not "todays youngsters" who celebrate these people as "heroes", it's our news media, especially our popular press, which is owned and controlled by people of our generation, and older, who determine what todays youngsters think! So blame them! Blame the BBC and ITV news, blame the Daily Mail, the Daily Express, and especially blame the Sun and its owner, as it is these that have created our celebrity culture!


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## Sister Eleff (Nov 28, 2006)

Thank you for this thread Stuart, a good reminder to us all (Applause) and I agree with the sentiments in all the previous posts (Thumb) (- even you Chouan (LOL) ) Yes, the media has a lot to answer for in so many ways.


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## John Rogers (May 11, 2004)

Chouan, what you say is very true,however you are in the best position(Teacher) to inform them of the past modern day history of the country,this can be done without brainwashing them, a trip to a war cemetery,or an DVD of the blitz of London,let them soak up what the old seniors done for their country.

John.


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## Keltic Star (Jan 21, 2006)

Chouan said:


> Unfortunately, having that attitude is not going to win them over, its just going to exacerbate the us and them feelings that already exist and alienate us from them, and them from us even more.


They don't need winning over, they need two years National Service or 10 years in the MN or fisheries, it didn't do us any harm.


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## Chouan (Apr 20, 2006)

John Rogers said:


> Chouan, what you say is very true,however you are in the best position(Teacher) to inform them of the past modern day history of the country,this can be done without brainwashing them, a trip to a war cemetery,or an DVD of the blitz of London,let them soak up what the old seniors done for their country.
> 
> John.


All of what you suggest is done by nearly all schools in Britain, certainly, nearly all schools in the South East have a day at the Somme or Ypres. Our History is certainly taught, and taught effectively, despite what the Mail, the Express and the Telegraph would have you beleive. 

Nevertheless, its hard to educate the young when their parents are encouraged not to value their children's educators. If the parents don't respect teachers, why would the children?


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## Noddy-Billing (Nov 6, 2007)

I do agree with Chouan that it is the 'popular press' which talks of 'Football Heroes'. I also know that children are taught, as far as time and the curriculum allows, about previous wars. I regularly attend the 'Last Post' ceremony at the Menin Gate at Ieper and am often moved, not just by the ceremonial, but by the reverence shown by all the youngsters, not all of whom are British, after seeing all the names of the Missing displayed on the wall panels. Its not the kids but those who influence them that need educating.


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## PJG1412 (Apr 3, 2008)

*New member*



ssr481 said:


> There is a gentleman who volunteers aboard the Liberty Ship SS JOHN W BROWN in Baltimore who has the same ailments...though not as much frostbite. He was on one of the convoys going into Murmansk when his ship was sunk off Norway. He managed to go ashore, was captured by the Germans, sunk off the German ship by the Russians, then picked up again by the Germans then spent the rest of the war in a POW camp. I talk with him whenever I'm on the BROWN... fascinating guy..


Is this the same man I meet 14 years ago on the JWB, he was sunk the second time by a mine. I suggested to him, that it could have been a British mine laid by my fathers ship HMS Adventure (minelayer cruiser) which spent a lot of time in the northern seas Norway/Russia. He was the highlight of our visit to this ship... a really great bunch of men and all volunteers. Our visit last year to the Jeremiah O'Brien was not quite the same.


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