# Holts- Blue Funnel - Can anyone Identify it?



## KennyP (Jan 4, 2019)

Hi
I have a photo of a Blue Funnel Line ship but no name for it. Can anyone help?
It is an A. Duncan copyright photograph.
TIA
Ken


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## makko (Jul 20, 2006)

It looks as if she is entering Gladstone locks. The Tower astern and Perch Rock lighthouse forward. Towline attached forward. As the actual "Tower" is not there, this dates it probably in the 1920's. There are so many sisters to choose from. I will throw my hat in the ring with Stentor.
Rgds.
Dave


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## Barrie Youde (May 29, 2006)

#2 

Wow!

My guess would be that she has completed a part-discharge at Gladstone and is, in point of fact, outward bound, possibly for the Clyde.

Why? Simply the proportions of the photograph. She looks to be far too much mid-stream (and making too much effort) to be making any approach into Gladstone Lock. She appears not to be deep-loaded (as though in from sea).

As to ship identification, alas I know not.


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## R651400 (Jun 18, 2005)

Looks very much like one of the 1920/23 Machaon class most famous of which was Phemius that lost her funnel in 1932 during a six day battle with a Caribbean hurricane.


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

Sorry about the late post. 

Not Machaon Class. The stem of the vessel in the Duncan photo is almost vertical and the Machaon class had a quite rake in the stem. Machaon had a break in the bridge deck (no. 3 Hatch). This vessel has a continuous bridge deck. The house on the poop is quite different from the Machaon class.

Not Stentor (2) is not one of the Idomendeus Class. Note the funnel. That class are quite different, noticeably large steam pipe forward on the main funnel. The ship in the photo did not have that.

The ship in photo is one of the Aeneas Class (passenger vessel). There were three of them, Aeneas (1), Ascanius (3) and Anchises (3). Three are practically identical. The only differences I can see them are in the portholes in foc's'le. The arrangement of them are different. The one that does match the Duncan photo is...… ANCHISES (3). 

Ref: Blue Funnel Line 'SHIPS IN FOCUS' by Clarkson, Harvey & Fenton. (1998)

Try search www. Useless!!! You can't beat a real BOOK!

Stephen ;-)


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## Steamseadog (Apr 11, 2008)

Looks like Anchises(3)
Same picture in Ships in focus - Blue funnel line p48
Same white stain on the Starboard ships side aft!


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## RHP (Nov 1, 2007)

I'm still amazed Makko in #2 identifies Gladstone dock and the Perch rock! What's the building behind the aft mast?


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## Barrie Youde (May 29, 2006)

#7 

Might it be New Brighton Tower?

I have no personal memory of that building but I know that it was there (or very nearby) at that time. The general lie of the land is unmistakeably the north-east corner of Wirral and the ship appears to flying Numeral Five pennant, the signal used at Liverpool (and nowhere else, as far as I know) to indicate the presence on board of a pilot chosen by the shipowner.


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## KennyP (Jan 4, 2019)

Wow, you guys are fantastic.
Thanks so much for all of the information.
Ken


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## JustWin (Sep 21, 2018)

Stephen J. Card said:


> Sorry about the late post.
> 
> Not Machaon Class. The stem of the vessel in the Duncan photo is almost vertical and the Machaon class had a quite rake in the stem. Machaon had a break in the bridge deck (no. 3 Hatch). This vessel has a continuous bridge deck. The house on the poop is quite different from the Machaon class.
> 
> ...


 Anchises >


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## Wismajorvik (Dec 29, 2011)

KennyP said:


> Wow, you guys are fantastic.
> Thanks so much for all of the information.
> Ken


https://www.shipsnostalgia.com/archive/index.php/t-16496.html


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## BillH (Oct 10, 2007)

ANCHISES (3rd of name) (1911 - 1941) Aeneas class steel steamship.
O.N. 131320. 10,046g. 6,380n. 493.0 x 60.4 x 37.1 feet.
Two T.3-cyl. (24", 40" & 68" x 48") by the shipbuilder, driving twin propeller shafts. 5,700 IHP. 14 kts.
12.1.1911: Launched by Workman, Clark & Company Ltd., Belfast (Yard No. 296) The Ocean Steamship Company Ltd. 
3.3.1911: Registered at Liverpool 
9.3.1911: Completed. 
10.3.1911: Departed from Belfast for Glasgow. 
3.8.1915 until 12.10.1917: Australian Expeditionary Force transport No. A 68. 
23.9.1918: Attacked with gunfire by a German submarine in the Atlantic. 
27.2.1941: Whilst on a voyage from Hong Kong via Cape Town and Freetown to Liverpool, was attacked by a German Condor long range bomber and damaged with bombs in a position 55.30N., 13.17W., 180 miles W.N.W. from Aran Island. Abandoned by 134 passengers and crew in six of her lifeboats. 33 crew remained with one lifeboat. 
28.2.1941: Attacked again by German aircraft and sunk west of Bloody Foreland, Ireland. 12 of the 33 crew on board were lost as victims of the high seas prevailing at the time, the remainder being rescued by HMS KINGCUP and HMCS ASSINIBIONE.


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

Steamseadog said:


> Looks like Anchises(3)
> Same picture in Ships in focus - Blue funnel line p48
> Same white stain on the Starboard ships side aft!



Definitely not the 'exact' photo...too many differences between the two photos but that stain on the starboard counter is definitely the same. Overside 'thunderbox' stain perhaps? Quite possibly the photographer took a couple of images,not at same time, but same week perhaps.

Stephen


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## makko (Jul 20, 2006)

Barrie Youde said:


> #7
> 
> Might it be New Brighton Tower?
> 
> I have no personal memory of that building but I know that it was there (or very nearby) at that time. The general lie of the land is unmistakeably the north-east corner of Wirral and the ship appears to flying Numeral Five pennant, the signal used at Liverpool (and nowhere else, as far as I know) to indicate the presence on board of a pilot chosen by the shipowner.


Hi Barrie,

The actual tower was demolished shortly after the First World War due to the structure falling into disrepair. 

The "base" building housed the Tower Ballroom and remained in use as a "dance" and concert venue up to, if I remember correctly, the late 60's when the Ballroom building was gutted by fire and demolished. All that remained were the Tower Grounds.

I attach an image that confirms the outline of the building in the photo. I was trying to make out the Water Tower but the VSL gets in the way! Defo New Brighton, in the 20's.

Cheers!
Dave


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## Barrie Youde (May 29, 2006)

Very many thanks, Dave!

That fits entirely with my own understanding - with a splendid photograph of the old tower structure. I remember hearing of the Tower Ballroom being gutted by fire - although I never did have the pleasure of performing the palais-glide therein!

Best wishes


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## Frank P (Mar 13, 2005)

I have just posted 3 photos of the Anchises in the gallery..

Cheers Frank


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

Frank,

Thanks for the three new photos of ANCHISES.


Searched SN Gallery and your original photo of ANCHISES (same as the post) was put on SN on 25 May 2013. Your photo is captioned on the photo 'SS ANCHISES'. 


Stephen


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## Luiz Carlos Bitencourt (Nov 28, 2018)

KennyP said:


> Hi
> I have a photo of a Blue Funnel Line ship but no name for it. Can anyone help?
> It is an A. Duncan copyright photograph.
> TIA
> Ken


Please see The Allen Collection (http://www.benjidog.co.uk/allen/Blue Funnel Line.html). Maybe it's Aeneas 1910 or some other.


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## Frank P (Mar 13, 2005)

Hello Stephen, Thanks for the info, I did check the gallery before posting the photos but I missed that photo, it was not me that posted on the 25 May 2013, it was Frank77 ...

Cheers Frank


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

Cheers Frank! Cheers to Frank77 too!

BTW.... the red Royal Viking houseflag? The 'normal' Royal Viking flag was white with a red eagle...matching the red eagle on the side of the funnel. I asked Captain Kjell Haugen on RV STAR, in mixed public company, why the eagle was white instead of red? He came back, "I guess it is an eagle with the sh*t kicked out of 'im!" 

Stephen


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## Frank P (Mar 13, 2005)

Hello Stephen, regarding the Royal Viking Line house flag we did have two types but from what I remember we mainly used the Red flag with the white Eagle, I can not remember when or why we used the White flag with the red Eagle. I thought that we might have used the White flag red Eagle on the tenders but when I checked it is also a red flag on those, there is a photo below. I was on the R V Star 1973 - 1976 and we visited Bermuda in October 1973. Which year was talking to Captain Haugen?

Photo *HERE*

Cheers Frank


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

Frank,
I cruised is the STAR in early 1991, one of her final Royal Viking voyages, before becoming the WESTWARD with NCL. Capt Haugen remained in the ship.

Anyhow, the flag, the RED flag is the Houseflag. Your tender is showing a red pennant flag, but with a white border (shown in the photo). I have other photos showing the STAR with a WHITE stem jack, with red eagle and a red border! Went through several other photos and it gets quite confusing. Each off those ship wore different stem jacks. Even the bow decoration on each vessel. The reason is quite simple, each ship was different owners, Royal Viking was the operating company. 

Went through shipspotting.com of several photos. It appears that ALL three sisters damaged their bows in heavy weather and it seems more than just once!

RV STAR was a fantastic ship to sail in. Two months later in the ship as WESTWARD the ship was fine, but the atmosphere was quite different, definitely not Norwegian style, similar when the Sagafjord and Vistafjord got non European crews.

Stephen


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## Frank P (Mar 13, 2005)

Stephen, regarding the ships owners, I worked for and was paid by BDS (Bergen Line) as were all the deck and engine room crew on the R V Star, the hotel staff were employed by Royal Viking Line via a Swiss company. The R V Sky was owned by Nordenfjelske and the R V Sea was owned by Klaveness, I never heard of the Deck or Engine crew changing ships but the Hotel staff did occasionally swap over.
Regarding Royal Viking Line I was told that after the ships were lengthened they lost their exclusivity, from 500 passengers to 800 passengers and the repeat passenger take up dropped off.

Frank


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## Stephen J. Card (Nov 5, 2006)

RV STAR became WESTWARD. OK, the same passenger numbers (800. You would think it would make difference, but they did and with one stroke. The large dining room was cut in half. The forward part (the original section) remained. The other section was used as a lounge. To cram 800 in the dining room.... two sittings! "This ship reminds me of last day of school... NO CLASS!" That aside those ships were still beautiful. Must be getting ling in the tooth, but still sailing,

Stephen


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