# What is a "Paniwalla"?



## assilem (Jun 5, 2010)

Hi,

I am researching my family history and have found mention of an ancestor who I believe was a crew member on 'Macedonia'. His station is listed as a *Paniwalla*, and I have not been able to find out what this means, whether it is where he his from or his position/job aboard the ship.

Any information about Paniwalla would be most appreciated!

Thanks.


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## trotterdotpom (Apr 29, 2005)

A paniwalla is a water carrier, I think. "Pani" is Hindi for water and "wallah" is the person who looks after a particular thing.

Don't recall it being a position on board ship, but seem to have heard it in reference to people ashore. Maybe the seamen would appoint someone to be a "pani wallah" while they were working on deck. Maybe some of the older members will know. Good luck.

If the ship is the P&O "Macedonia", there is a photo at http://www.simplonpc.co.uk/PO_Liners2.html#anchor6717
that may be of interest to you.

John T.

PS Another thought, maybe something to do with the engine room - especially on a steam ship.


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## gordy (Apr 18, 2008)

Would it be the engineer who looked after the evaporators? (Water makers)


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## uisdean mor (Sep 4, 2008)

Panni Wallah was the seaman usually assigned to the engine room who carried the cool water - usually in a small butt or insulated carrier. This was drinking water for those working in the engine room and was a god send in the hotter waters and seasons. This was in the time before mass refrigeration and easy access to cool water. Sometimes these was a small tap on deck which had been led through the domestic veg/fridge store and this offered a cooler drink. While working in Shat al Arab in september in around 1970's weighed boiler suit at end of a strenuous stint on some bit of failed kit or other - empty boiler suit - saturated with sweat weighed a stone.The Panni Wallah was an essential member of the engine room staff. 
Rgds 
Uisdean


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## trotterdotpom (Apr 29, 2005)

Thanks Uisdean, thought maybe something like that. But was he signed on in that position or just nominated from amongst the engine room crew?

John T.


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## michael charters (Apr 4, 2010)

Panni also means bread in Greek/French could he have been the baker?


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## uisdean mor (Sep 4, 2008)

John 
Different crews had different ways of allocating the jobs. We had Chittagong, Calcutta and sometimes Goanese crews. From memory the decisions were made by the serangs and it depended very very much which was the senior serang ( deck or engine). 
The seaman himself would have been signed on as GP and the various lower level jobs were panni wallah, topaz and the assisant to the casab whose name I cannot remember.
Tunda Panni was the oft heard cry when things got really hot and of course there was recourse to the stewards working store(fridge) where a case of tennents could oft be found in preparation for some after deck refreshment when it was pointless tryingto get cool or "cleaned up" before going back down the pit. 
Rgds 
Uisdean


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## uisdean mor (Sep 4, 2008)

Sorry no - roti is hindi for bread so the baker is the roti wallah. Pan is also Spanish for bread and just for cultural significance is also mentioned by the great Matt McGinn ( of the Calton) where yer breid could be plain or pan 
Rgds 
Uisdean


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## i.cossey (Jul 10, 2008)

I was only with P & O for a short while but I seem to remember that a panniwallah was the indian mate to the european plumber.


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## Derek Roger (Feb 19, 2005)

I think it possible the pani wallah was an assistant to the ships carpenter "chippie " who was resonsible for taking tank soundings and also for the loading or "taking on " of fresh water when in port.

Derek


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## Trader (Jul 1, 2005)

On Blue Funnel the chippies mate was Chinese and called Tomolo if I remember rightly. He did all the water soundings and took on fresh water in port.

Alec.


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

Shades of Kipling's, Gunga Din! "You're a better man than I, Gunga Din." 
Gunga Din was a "pani wallah."


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## Supergoods (Nov 25, 2007)

The chippie's helper was more likely to be a lakri wallah

Ian


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

Click on this for a poem about a Pani Wallah:-
http://quotations.about.com/cs/poemlyrics/a/Gunga_Din.htm


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## Derek Roger (Feb 19, 2005)

Supergoods said:


> The chippie's helper was more likely to be a lakri wallah
> 
> Ian


lakari is wood so i guess you may me correct ? In hindi Tiger Woods would be Burra Billie Lakri ?

Cheers Derek


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

Supergoods said:


> The chippie's helper was more likely to be a lakri wallah
> 
> Ian


Not with Chinese crews: Tomolo is right (emphasis on first syllable)


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## Derek Roger (Feb 19, 2005)

Very apt Hugh . Derek ( The poem )


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## randcmackenzie (Aug 31, 2005)

In more modern times (1960 ....) a pani wallah was definitely a donkey man, responsible for looking after the boiler(s) and on watch with, among others:

A senior engineer (2nd, 3rd or 4th)
A junior engineer,
An ag wallah (greaser)
A tal wallah (oiler)

Where are Messrs Pottinger and PhiltheChill when you need them?

B/R.


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## Derek Roger (Feb 19, 2005)

randcmackenzie said:


> In more modern times (1960 ....) a pani wallah was definitely a donkey man, responsible for looking after the boiler(s) and on watch with, among others:
> 
> A senior engineer (2nd, 3rd or 4th)
> A junior engineer,
> ...


must be on vacation ( leave ) . I must say that I never heard that postion in Brocklebanks . The order of pay was ; coal trimmer ; ag whallah ( fireman ) Tindal ; Tail Whallah ; Cassab and Serang . Derek


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## Supergoods (Nov 25, 2007)

Hugh Ferguson said:


> Not with Chinese crews: Tomolo is right (emphasis on first syllable)


But the conversation in general is about the Hindi titles

Ian


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## randcmackenzie (Aug 31, 2005)

OK Derek,

I'll take your word for it, but i was pretty sure I recalled the title from Denholm's Indian crews in the sixties.

B/R.


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## Don A.Macleod (Jul 11, 2004)

Agree with Derek, don't remember having a panni wallah on Brocks ships. Could he have been someone who was carried on passenger vessels to ensure they were always kept supplied with drinking water requirements? Don't know really,just a thought.


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## Billieboy (May 18, 2009)

Pani wallah, the fireman responsible for keeping the waterlevel in the boilers,(chief feed check and feed pump operator), shoreside in Cardiff, we had a Somali crew in the boiler room, one of whom was called the waterman or Pani wallah.


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## oglebilluk (Mar 14, 2006)

The title definitely existed in Brocks, but I think only on the older water tube boiler ships. The job was to constantly look at the periscope to the gauge glasses whilst manoeuvring. At other times I presume they did normal day work, which must have been a welcome break from the boredom!

Bill


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## Nigel Wing (Sep 26, 2006)

Some water related phrases, when sailing with Indian crewed ships, - lime-pani, brilliant diluted lime juice in a massive jug bought to the engine room bottom plates on long stand byes, before the days of engine control rooms and air conditioning. Also the lament when the toilets would not flush, " no sani-pani, sahib "
Other members can probably remember more examples.
Cheers
Nigel.


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## Derek Roger (Feb 19, 2005)

oglebilluk said:


> The title definitely existed in Brocks, but I think only on the older water tube boiler ships. The job was to constantly look at the periscope to the gauge glasses whilst manoeuvring. At other times I presume they did normal day work, which must have been a welcome break from the boredom!
> 
> Bill


I dont remember the title Bill but you are correct on the firemen being on station viewing the periscopes on the water tube vessels . The feed was controlled by the Robo valve but during manoeuvring they would sometimes stick and the job of the fireman was to run up to the boiler tops and give the lever on the Robo a shake to free it up .
On the Scotch boiler vessels such as Maipura each boiler ( 3 ) had a man controling the boiler levels ( which were manual) during stand byes . When full away the controls could be set and required little adjustment ; this was done by the engineers .

Cheers Derek


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## randcmackenzie (Aug 31, 2005)

Acha heh - boiler water watcher.


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## joebuckham (Apr 1, 2005)

paniwalla a greaser

from british medical journal see attachment


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## sidsal (Nov 13, 2007)

Pani walla - translates into water man - or water fellow.
In Brocklebank's 1917 vintage MAIHAR (and other ships) where there was no running water a common occurence was to shout down into the engine room when in port -
"Pinaka pani pump chelow" - meaning - " Put the fresh water pump on " - to fill the galley tank so we could fill our container with a spout on from the tap.
Not sure of the spelling - it's a long time ago


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## Derek Roger (Feb 19, 2005)

sidsal said:


> Pani walla - translates into water man - or water fellow.
> In Brocklebank's 1917 vintage MAIHAR (and other ships) where there was no running water a common occurence was to shout down into the engine room when in port -
> "Pinaka pani pump chelow" - meaning - " Put the fresh water pump on " - to fill the galley tank so we could fill our container with a spout on from the tap.
> Not sure of the spelling - it's a long time ago


I remember that on Maipura . The call down the engine room was Pani Hi . ( water up )


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## sidsal (Nov 13, 2007)

Derek, 
According to the Malim Sahib's Hinhdustani - "Hi" means Am, Is or Are.
Hence Pani hi probably means "Is there fresh water".
"What time is it ?" is Kitna budja hi ?. I have used this question to my wife for 50 years- never - What time is it ? !!
Amazingly this book is still available from Brown, Son & Ferguson - or it was a couple of years ago.
Happy days
Sid


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## Derek Roger (Feb 19, 2005)

Happy Days indeed Sid . I have just returned to Canada after a long visit to Scoland during which time I spent a bit of time with ex Brock Alan Attack . When in the pub we would converse in mixture of Malim Sahib ; Scots ; Yorkshire and a smattering of Japanese which seemed to confuse the other clients who had not a clue what we were on about.
Still kids at heart .
Cheers Derek


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

I'd love to have listened to some of that!


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## Supergoods (Nov 25, 2007)

sidsal said:


> Derek,
> According to the Malim Sahib's Hinhdustani - "Hi" means Am, Is or Are.
> Hence Pani hi probably means "Is there fresh water".
> "What time is it ?" is Kitna budja hi ?. I have used this question to my wife for 50 years- never - What time is it ? !!
> ...


I found a copy from Amazon.co.uk and ordered it two days ago as i have to get back in practice after 48 years before the Brocks reunion in October.
Plenty of Indians around these parts, the only problem is they speak better English than I do

Ian


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## hughesy (Dec 18, 2007)

Hugh Ferguson said:


> Shades of Kipling's, Gunga Din! "You're a better man than I, Gunga Din."
> Gunga Din was a "pani wallah."


thats a great poem? I remember the old movie Gunga Din, forget the actors, maybe David Niven was among em??

all the best
Hughesy(Thumb)


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## Hugh Ferguson (Sep 4, 2006)

Yeah! You can't beat a bit of Kipling to stir up the old corpuscles!


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## John Campbell (Aug 30, 2005)

On the Southbank our Captain Smith only knew two words of Hindi and they were "Pani Bando" when he wanted the sea water shut off on deck. Which meant "make fast the water"


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## sidsal (Nov 13, 2007)

Happy memories:
Remember Avis Asti ( heave away gently)
Aria Asti (Lower awy gently)
Bando ( make fast) - as per pani bando.
Jungli walla - madmann.
Cabardar niche ( look out below)
During ww2 under strict blackout one heard the low, monotonous sound of the lascars as they made their way in the dark saying - Cabardar - to warn anyone of their approach.


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## KIWI (Jul 27, 2005)

According to my memory a Pani Wallah in P&O was the equivalent of a Donkeyman.Of course in most companies a most frequent use of Pani was,phonetic spelling," tora tunda pani".Relating to the amount of water required in ones gin. KIWI


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## John Briggs (Feb 12, 2006)

Or in that well known ditty, "I love a Lassie" where she would sarf kurro her ars*hole with tora tunda pani from the well.


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## uisdean mor (Sep 4, 2008)

Tum Lakri Lakri Tum
Uidsdean

Aswell as Chota lal jiggy jiggy topee


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## Derek Roger (Feb 19, 2005)

uisdean mor said:


> Tum Lakri Lakri Tum
> Uidsdean
> 
> Aswell as Chota lal jiggy jiggy topee


You would ; would you ?

Little Red Riding Hood ?


Have one on me John . Derek


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## jimthehat (Aug 5, 2006)

sidsal said:


> Happy memories:
> Remember Avis Asti ( heave away gently)
> Aria Asti (Lower awy gently)
> Bando ( make fast) - as per pani bando.
> ...


Sousti wallah(lazy soandso.
jildi jildi(hurry hurry)

jim


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## oglebilluk (Mar 14, 2006)

and what about Chotta Bo Decko

Bill








Derek Roger said:


> You would ; would you ?
> 
> Little Red Riding Hood ?
> 
> ...


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## Derek Roger (Feb 19, 2005)

oglebilluk said:


> and what about Chotta Bo Decko
> 
> Bill


Ba Ba cala Mesh


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## John Briggs (Feb 12, 2006)

I remember on the Indian Coast in BI that we had a large collection of nursery rhymes in Hindi. They were absolutely hilarious and yet nearly all of them I have forgotten.

Would someone please, please, please start a thread on Hindi Nursery Rhymes - I am sure it would be popular!


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## gwzm (Nov 7, 2005)

A Brocklebank ditty to the tune of I love a Lassie:

I love lassie
A bonnie black Madrasi
She's as black as the hubs o' f*****n' hell
She cleans her teeth wi' charcoal
An' saf karoos 'er a$se'ole
Wi' tora tunda pani from the well

Mods please delete if considered too un-PC for sensitive souls.

= salaams es bv de gwzm + VA . .


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## Chris Field (Apr 3, 2005)

I can still remember some of those Lascari terms from the fifties in Ellermans:e.g.
Serang (=bosun),tindal = leading hand, cassab = storeman,masalchi = galley cleaner, avis = hoist, arryah = lower away,.....
and would like to hear more from those of you with more living cells in your brains...
I seem to remember that a wallah was just anyone linked with any particular duty =workman- and so the pani wallah was involved with water in some way.


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## Tony Crompton (Jul 26, 2005)

Tunda Pani Purri Wallah....Coldstream Guard

Tony


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## Sabastapol (Feb 18, 2009)

Frankly the best Wallah of the lot is Char Wallah. Nothing like it except more of it(Thumb)


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## Chris Field (Apr 3, 2005)

Back come the brain cells:

"Taura chini, taura char
Bombay chichi boht acha!"

= Little bit of milk, little bit of tea, a Bombay half-breed girl is LOVERLY!


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