# Nostalgia !



## frank elliott

All the threads submitted to SN seem to reflect on the life and times at sea during the 1950's, 60's and 70's and all were telling the
stories of the good times and the good ships and great shipping
companies. There are no such 'nostalgic' memorable stories of the 1980's and through to the present times. Why is this so?
Maybe I know the answers,but I would be interested in reading
other SN members opinions


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## A.D.FROST

In a word "CONTAINERISATION"


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## signalman

Nostalgia ain't what it used to be - that's why.


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## Monket

Only old people suffer from nostalgia.


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## terence

think ist the same as [music] 50s 60 70s nostalgia,
untill amy winehouse
terry music man


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## garry Norton

Thats when they decided we did not need a merchant marine and flagged everything to FOC


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## Keltic Star

garry Norton said:


> Thats when they decided we did not need a merchant marine and flagged everything to FOC


It would appear that in the three years that you have been a member of SN you have failed to notice that this site represents seafarers and those interested in the sea from all around the world. Ships Nostalgia is international in nature, not an exclusive enclave of those who sailed under the Red, White or Blue Ensigns.

You will also find that thousands of British seamen on this site, including myself, also sailed quite happily and profitably on Flags of Necessity.


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## KernowJim

Turn around times in ports became faster and so less time was to be had for R & R. 

Health and Safety became more stringent.

Shipping Companies started to be run by accountants and not Ex-Seafarers which led to cost cutting across the board.

And last but not least, The Drug and Alcohol Policies of companies which if they did exist in the 50's, 60's & 70's were not fully or properly policed as they tend to be now.
It's a shame but that, as they say, is progress.

That said I have still had a few cracking nights up the road over the past few years and being at sea is still a good career.


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## alan ward

I agree with all of the above but in addition,there was an added adventure,foreign travel.In todays world everybody,virtually from birth,has travelled abroad be it on holiday or work.The outside world is also available at the touch of a finger through TV,t`interweb I can even talk to my sons in Vancouver and Auckland through Skype.We had National Service,Whickers World or the Merch.Everywhere we went was new,experiences,cultures,women,bars,beaches and languages.We visited places that we couldn`t even spell.You lost virtually every contact with your friends,family and girlfriend for months,no mobile `phone,no pc just the written letter and many`Dear Johns`amongst those.Non stop stimulus from every angle you`d go away at 16 meet people and see things that your parents and grandparents hadn`t seen unless like many of us on here you came from a seafaring family.Boys of early teens shared a mess with men of many years experience of the sea and its multitude of traditions,jobs and pitfalls you learned fast and you learned hard,only Cunard carried passengers!


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## alan ward

Speaking of sons,any of you lads in Auckland?call in at my boy Neils cafe on Beach Road,he sells Staffordshire Oatcakes for those of you who have never had the pleasure it`s also known as the Tunstall Tortilla,Chell Chapatti or the Burslem Burrito a silky,soft piece of wonder wrapped around a filling of your choice.Some of the oddities you Kiwis order worries me a little but try grilled bacon and melted cheese,you know it makes sense.Look him up on FB it`s under Original Staffordshire Oatcakes.This has been a public service announcement.


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## hawkey01

Alan,

I think you summed it up very well and we will pretend we did not see the advert!!. It is a long way to go for an Oatcake. Just returned from a 10 hour flight, that was at the limit of my patience. Could never stand the 24 hrs to NZ in one hit, so no Oatcake for me.

Hawkey01


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## alan ward

hawkey01 said:


> Alan,
> 
> I think you summed it up very well and we will pretend we did not see the advert!!. It is a long way to go for an Oatcake. Just returned from a 10 hour flight, that was at the limit of my patience. Could never stand the 24 hrs to NZ in one hit, so no Oatcake for me.
> 
> Hawkey01


Truth is guys,I haven`t seen him in 2 years and any news of him is welcome.I thought it would be good fun if some of you lot from Auckland called in and said`Your Dad says hello`he`s a friendly boy and always sociable and is much missed.


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## garry Norton

In reply to the gentleman who said I had failed to notice that Ships Nostalgia is international in nature I would like to point out my experience is international in nature as I have sailed on all types of vessels under NZ,Aust., British, Panama, Liberian, Bermudian, UAE, Solomon Islands flag. I was also a Honduran vessel inspector. My pilotage was in the Solomon Islands,UK, Saudi, Bahrain, and UAE.
FOC in my experience contributed greatly to the decline in life at sea as we lost many of our perks eg pensions, leave entitlements and accident compensation.Today many of our own shipping companies use recruitment agencies to recruit so they can dodge UK taxes.In turn today most nations use ships personnel from less advanced nations as they pay less and these people are not likely to contribute to ships nostalgia.
How many FOC vessels are manned by people using Ships Nostalgia


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## Troppo

I was at sea 1980-91, and had a great time...


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## Oz.

The guys and gals that went to sea in the 80's and later arent old enough to be nostalgic. I see much of shipping in the sleepy port of Geelong and visit ships and meet crews daily - I can tell you that theres not a lot to be nostalgic about when compared to what most of us here saw and did back then. But, I'm looking at presnt day life with old, somewhat faded eyes. I spoke with a Philipino Third Mate just yesterday who informed me that life at sea was no good- he didnt see his girlfriend often enough because he signed six month contracts. I didnt bother to tell him we signed 2 year contracts.


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## Keltic Star

garry Norton said:


> In reply to the gentleman who said I had failed to notice that Ships Nostalgia is international in nature I would like to point out my experience is international in nature as I have sailed on all types of vessels under NZ,Aust., British, Panama, Liberian, Bermudian, UAE, Solomon Islands flag. I was also a Honduran vessel inspector. My pilotage was in the Solomon Islands,UK, Saudi, Bahrain, and UAE.
> *FOC in my experience contributed greatly to the decline in life at sea as we lost many of our perks eg pensions, leave entitlements and accident compensation.Today many of our own shipping companies use recruitment agencies to recruit so they can dodge UK taxes*.In turn today most nations use ships personnel from less advanced nations as they pay less and these people are not likely to contribute to ships nostalgia.
> 
> How many FOC vessels are manned by people using Ships Nostalgia[/QUOTE
> 
> But you refuse to accept that it is not your inherent right as a Brit, to be overpaid for a job that can be adequately done cheaper by someone who does not need all your "perks" or pay exorbitant UK tax, to do an honest days work and live well in his own environment.
> 
> You cannot prevent international trading rights but successive UK governments have condoned foreign seamen sailing Home Trade on what should be cabotage protected routes. I certainly didn't vote such incompetents into office.
> 
> Modern technology and better universal education is not the fault of FOC's as you call them, those affected have not been smart enough to reacted to change.
> 
> From your foreign experience, I cannot see why you didn't grab the bull by the horns and own or charter a few ships with Flag of Necessity advantages or incorporate in a tax shelter. It sure worked for those of us who were entrepreneurial in spirit.


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## spongebob

Quote

_The guys and gals that went to sea in the 80's and later aren’t old enough to be nostalgic._

I think that for ones own sake “nostalgia” should not intervene with life too much until a person reaches at least their sixties. To indulge in it earlier condones the risk of ignoring the vibrant future that we should still be young enough to indulge in.
Real nostalgia should be the domain and preserve of the older person, the septuagenarians and octogenarians that are entering that zone of uncertain future but have a fulfilled past that can be dwelt upon, indulged, exaggerated or fanaticised to the heart’s content.
Nostalgia can be likened to good wine or aged single malt, the longer left the better. No matter what life you have led there are always many good times and certainly enough of them to allow the obliteration of the bad ones if needed.
Old Merchant Seamen of whatever rank or calling have a particularly rich store to draw on, one that hardly exists in the present concept of such trade, one that few others have had the opportunity of, and one that is no longer there.
Some of us have worked in areas and skills that no longer exist. Perhaps as a fireman or trimmer on a coal fired ship or an engineer on a reciprocating steam engine powered vessel.
You might have been a Sparky that kept us in touch with the world so remote then, especially when we were mid Atlantic or Pacific. It was probably one of the most short-lived professions yet, spanning from the time in December 1901 when Marconi proved that it was possible to send radio signals around the globe until the latter 20th century when satellite phones and the like replaced the exacting skill of the trembling finger 
You could well have been have been a navigator that used age-old methods of sextant sights, time and charts and even the stars to find the way.
All of these skills have gone, there are no such jobs now so if you are one of these now lucky men just lie back and indulge in whatever Nostalgia turns you on.

Bob


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## TonyAllen

OR you could have been a galley boy washing pans or a peggy ,nowadays I guess theyhave gone with ready to go food.


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## Naytikos

RE _Keltic Star _post 16
(Applause)(Applause)(Applause)


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## Keltic Star

spongebob said:


> Quote
> 
> _The guys and gals that went to sea in the 80's and later aren’t old enough to be nostalgic._
> 
> I think that for ones own sake “nostalgia” should not intervene with life too much until a person reaches at least their sixties. To indulge in it earlier condones the risk of ignoring the vibrant future that we should still be young enough to indulge in.
> Real nostalgia should be the domain and preserve of the older person, the septuagenarians and octogenarians that are entering that zone of uncertain future but have a fulfilled past that can be dwelt upon, indulged, exaggerated or fanaticised to the heart’s content.
> Nostalgia can be likened to good wine or aged single malt, the longer left the better. No matter what life you have led there are always many good times and certainly enough of them to allow the obliteration of the bad ones if needed.
> Old Merchant Seamen of whatever rank or calling have a particularly rich store to draw on, one that hardly exists in the present concept of such trade, one that few others have had the opportunity of, and one that is no longer there.
> Some of us have worked in areas and skills that no longer exist. Perhaps as a fireman or trimmer on a coal fired ship or an engineer on a reciprocating steam engine powered vessel.
> You might have been a Sparky that kept us in touch with the world so remote then, especially when we were mid Atlantic or Pacific. It was probably one of the most short-lived professions yet, spanning from the time in December 1901 when Marconi proved that it was possible to send radio signals around the globe until the latter 20th century when satellite phones and the like replaced the exacting skill of the trembling finger
> You could well have been have been a navigator that used age-old methods of sextant sights, time and charts and even the stars to find the way.
> All of these skills have gone, there are no such jobs now so if you are one of these now lucky men just lie back and indulge in whatever Nostalgia turns you on.
> 
> Bob


Spongebob, extremely well said .(Thumb)(Thumb)


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## MikeK

A.D.FROST said:


> In a word "CONTAINERISATION"


 And ACCOUNTANTS, COMPUTERISATION and last but not least HEALTH AND SAFETY as in licence to print forms for the filling when you should be getting on with your job !


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## Troppo

_Flag of Necessity_

What lovely spin....


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## Duncan112

I think we are all nostalgic for our time at sea, and when in the bar on an evening the old stagers would say something like "Ah but you should have seen it 20 years ago - now that was going to sea" and when you became an old stager you were nostalgic for 20 years ago when you started - it's all relative, I think in 20 years time those just going to sea (if there are any just going to sea) will log on to this forum and be nostalgic for now.


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## sparks69

I have never met anyone in the past 25 years or so that didn't enjoy their time at sea - what ever they did or became later !


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## spongebob

As I have said before, a family gathering and you, the senior member says;

"I remember when I was at sea"

Those of similar age that have not had such an experience roll their eyes

Your children's generation take this as a cue to refill their glasses or go out-doors for a smoke.

The teenagers pull faces and mouth "here we go again"

And the young ones, the wee tots, gather around, eyes aglow, to hear what might be another believable story of adventure.

Bob


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## andysk

hawkey01 said:


> Alan,
> 
> I think you summed it up very well and we will pretend we did not see the advert!!. It is a long way to go for an Oatcake. Just returned from a 10 hour flight, that was at the limit of my patience. Could never stand the 24 hrs to NZ in one hit, so no Oatcake for me.
> 
> Hawkey01


Couldn't agree more Hawkeye, I'd love to get back out there again, but Sussex to Hamilton, 30+ hours door-to-door, is just a tad too much discomfort in one go !


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## Mick Spear

spongebob said:


> Quote
> 
> _The guys and gals that went to sea in the 80's and later aren’t old enough to be nostalgic._
> 
> I think that for ones own sake “nostalgia” should not intervene with life too much until a person reaches at least their sixties. To indulge in it earlier condones the risk of ignoring the vibrant future that we should still be young enough to indulge in.
> Real nostalgia should be the domain and preserve of the older person, the septuagenarians and octogenarians that are entering that zone of uncertain future but have a fulfilled past that can be dwelt upon, indulged, exaggerated or fanaticised to the heart’s content.
> Nostalgia can be likened to good wine or aged single malt, the longer left the better. No matter what life you have led there are always many good times and certainly enough of them to allow the obliteration of the bad ones if needed.
> Old Merchant Seamen of whatever rank or calling have a particularly rich store to draw on, one that hardly exists in the present concept of such trade, one that few others have had the opportunity of, and one that is no longer there.
> Some of us have worked in areas and skills that no longer exist. Perhaps as a fireman or trimmer on a coal fired ship or an engineer on a reciprocating steam engine powered vessel.
> You might have been a Sparky that kept us in touch with the world so remote then, especially when we were mid Atlantic or Pacific. It was probably one of the most short-lived professions yet, spanning from the time in December 1901 when Marconi proved that it was possible to send radio signals around the globe until the latter 20th century when satellite phones and the like replaced the exacting skill of the trembling finger
> You could well have been have been a navigator that used age-old methods of sextant sights, time and charts and even the stars to find the way.
> All of these skills have gone, there are no such jobs now so if you are one of these now lucky men just lie back and indulge in whatever Nostalgia turns you on.
> 
> Bob


Sorry Spongebob, i can't agree with your opinion on Nostalgia. MN nostalgia to me is my last trip and backwards. If we drew the line at those over 60 years old to post nostalgic pics and yarns then we wouldn't have as many pics and yarns as we have now. I went to sea in 1980 and i was fortunate enough to catch the tail end of the commercial shipping sector and have spent the last 21 years in the RFA and there is a lot of history there to write about etc; lots of fun too!
Just take a look at Locking Splice, Pat Macardle and Alex Salmonds' galleries - as examples, neither have reached 60 years old.
Mick S


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## Varley

I agre with Mick. Post as soon as YOU feel nostalgic - after all, you might not make 60!


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## john richards

*Tom Cruise To Play Jack Reacher.*

Anybody familiar with Lee Child`s Jack Reacher Novels might be suprised that the choice of Tom Cruise to play Reacher. Ex Military Policeman described in the series as 6 foot 5 inches Tall & 240/250lbs. It has been sugested that Tom has already contacted Willie Carson about borrowing his box that he uses alongside Claire Balding! Are there no big Hunks left in Hollywood? John Richards.


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## TonyAllen

john richards said:


> Anybody familiar with Lee Child`s Jack Reacher Novels might be suprised that the choice of Tom Cruise to play Reacher. Ex Military Policeman described in the series as 6 foot 5 inches Tall & 240/250lbs. It has been sugested that Tom has already contacted Willie Carson about borrowing his box that he uses alongside Claire Balding! Are there no big Hunks left in Hollywood? John Richards.


Read Every lee childs novel so did my late wife and she would be appalled at the choice of tom cruise as jack reacher. the only one that comes close is the ROCK ,but he would have to take acting lessons


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## Pat Kennedy

john richards said:


> Anybody familiar with Lee Child`s Jack Reacher Novels might be suprised that the choice of Tom Cruise to play Reacher. Ex Military Policeman described in the series as 6 foot 5 inches Tall & 240/250lbs. It has been sugested that Tom has already contacted Willie Carson about borrowing his box that he uses alongside Claire Balding! Are there no big Hunks left in Hollywood? John Richards.


Tom Cruise as Reacher!
Why not Julian Clary?(Jester)


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## spongebob

Mick Spear said:


> Sorry Spongebob, i can't agree with your opinion on Nostalgia. MN nostalgia to me is my last trip and backwards. If we drew the line at those over 60 years old to post nostalgic pics and yarns then we wouldn't have as many pics and yarns as we have now. I went to sea in 1980 and i was fortunate enough to catch the tail end of the commercial shipping sector and have spent the last 21 years in the RFA and there is a lot of history there to write about etc; lots of fun too!
> Just take a look at Locking Splice, Pat Macardle and Alex Salmonds' galleries - as examples, neither have reached 60 years old.
> Mick S


Mick

I was not knocking nostalgia as such but just suggesting that it is mainly the territory of the older person who's future is limited by what ever the great leveler is going to be as opposed to the younger person who still has great visions of the future. I certainly did have as a sixty year old. Let us all dream on and back to our heart's content.

Bob


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## Mick Spear

spongebob said:


> Mick
> 
> I was not knocking nostalgia as such but just suggesting that it is mainly the territory of the older person who's future is limited by what ever the great leveler is going to be as opposed to the younger person who still has great visions of the future. I certainly did have as a sixty year old. Let us all dream on and back to our heart's content.
> 
> Bob


I understand that Bob, no worries. By the way is your username 'spongebob' relative to the modern cartoon series 'spongebob and square pants?'
Mick


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## spongebob

Mick Spear said:


> I understand that Bob, no worries. By the way is your username 'spongebob' relative to the modern cartoon series 'spongebob and square pants?'
> Mick


Hello Mick, I have adopted the Spongebob user name at the insistence of my family who claim that I am always in the water, under the water or playing with water. I don't know much about the cartoon character but I must tune in sometime

Regards Bob


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## Varley

And we thought it was your capacity to absorb liquid and remain stable!


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## alan ward

.....or hold your liquor


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## Graham P Powell

They used to say that you hadn't been to sea till you had been on the coast.
Judging by one of my friends experiences on flat irons and other colliers
that is probably true!.
Tom Cruise as Jack Reacher. Unbelievable. Reacher is supposed to be 6' 5''
.....
rgds
Graham Powell


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## Rodney

The only good news about Tom Cruise playing (not acting as) Reacher is there will be lots of castings for five foot bad guys.

Rodney


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## spongebob

Quotes

And we thought it was your capacity to absorb liquid and remain stable!

.....or hold your liquor

There is a grain of truth in both those assumptions but now fast fading. 

Cheers Bob


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## TonyAllen

nostalgia can come at any age ie.my grandson wishers he could have his last bithday party again and his next one is i 2 weeks time .figure that one out Tony


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## tom roberts

Nostalgia. Ah yes after 15 years at sea from 1954 on, its all I have left, spewing my guts up on a Savages coaster, from sweating away chipping rust out in the blazing sun up the Gulf at 16yrs old to freezing my nuts off around St Johns in Newfie chipping ice to get the derriks ready, to being dumped by Cunard when they laid up the Sylvania and other ships putting many old loyal crew on the shore ,no redundancy pay them days,tho I must say it was my choice to call it a day when I paid off the Sylvania.But in those 15yrs I had a whale of a time, how I wonder would a poor boy from Wales ,whose only other options to make a living was to go down the pit ,farming, the local pop works ever get to see the wonders of the bars of the world in some of the most exotic ports the oh so beautiful ladies that frequented these places,to watch the sun rise and set on oceans that only others can dream about or if they are rich have to pay a fortune to see.Yes like all seamen we moaned that we were underpaid treated like s**t by some skippers and by all the ship owners,had our heads kicked in by Aussie cops and other over zealous police in various countries had needles for all sorts of mysterious aillments,and welcmed home after a long trip with those famous words (when are you going back)? My answer was always when I am skint.Maybe I only have memories so what,at least I can share them with other seafaring brethren,as those who have never been so lucky as us will never believe how it was.


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## Graham P Powell

Lovely writing Tom. That about somes it all up.....
rgds
Graham Powell


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## spongebob

At a risk of sounding as if I am stuttering I offer this old post of four years ago

*Nostalgia- The old Mariner's Glory Box*


*My on line dictionary defines this as a bittersweet longing for things, persons or situations of the past.*
*My concise **Oxford** dictionary defines it as sentimental yearning and wistful memory of earlier times*
*The on line Webster dictionary asks for money before it tells you its definition so we forego that one*
*I’ll settle for the first two sources as satisfying my idea of nostalgia. It is a state of mind that is perhaps intensified by age as now in my seventies I look at life’s programme and appreciate that the years have taken me well past the fulcrum or point of balance to a era that yields a long and memorable past and a somewhat shorter and less predictable future so why not indulge. Indulgence in the past becomes a pleasant and fruitful way of filling in some of the wakeful hours.*
*It is something that can be activated at any time of the day, at any tick of the clock. A thousand triggers can tempt one back into the folds of the aging mind to the ambrosia of the memory banks*
*Perhaps one can liken the earlier years of youth and young manhood as an easy flat fast moving surface but a slope develops with age. As we near the apex, or whatever the end is going to be, the incline starts looking very steep and it is easier to look in the rear vision mirror of life and dream of turning back.*
*I have a new engine following a quadruple heart by-pass but my clutch is slipping, my gearbox has lost a cog or two, my shock absorbers are shocking and my back end differential is indifferent to say the least. To advance to other areas of performance would be to admit that the discs are becoming floppy; the hard drive is so maximized with memory that it is reluctant to save many more files of life and a few rouge viruses have hacked into the personal records.*
*So why not turn life’s vehicle around, ignore the forward steeply rising slope and gently coast back down hill, without brakes, through those fields of nostalgia with its constantly changing seasons, colours and hues, its blooms and wild life, its all there for the taking. *
*Memories are perhaps one of older age’s most valuable assets, without them one would be stuck in a bog of no mans land with only that steepening hill to contemplate. Memories are your personal library of books music and film, a library that can be vast if you put your thoughts to it and the mind usually has the ability to filter out most of the past traumas and disappointments while intensifying the thrills and joys of the bygone years.*
*I am one who has been blessed with a prodigious recall of my past right back to childhood even though I sometimes cannot remember whether I have taken my pills in the morning. So why not spend time in the memory “study” reading and enjoying the past before the mind’s hard drive crashes and plonks one into the limbo of senility and real old age.*
*An analogy could be a past “Top gear” TV programme showing Jeremy Clarkson crashing and bashing his way to the North Pole in a Toyota Hilux 4-wheel drive. Highly entertaining to watch but a hugely punishing effort for both man and vehicle only to get to a geographic point that looked no different from the terrain that had surrounded him for days, no growth, no sound, no colour and I mused;*
*“Turn back Jeremy, head toward the Equator instead, it’s warmer, sunnier, has golden sands with palm trees and its all easy going down hill”*

*Bob *


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## david.hopcroft

I saw an article in a shipping magazine recently describing a 60,000 container ship that could sail with 9 crew. There's not much you can get nostalgic about on that I guess !

David
+


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## alan ward

david.hopcroft said:


> I saw an article in a shipping magazine recently describing a 60,000 container ship that could sail with 9 crew. There's not much you can get nostalgic about on that I guess !
> 
> David
> +


I`ve just read a book written by a bloke called Peter Brown,he has a small barrel of India Pale Ale brewed at original strength and tries to take it by sea to India,starting with a narrow boat from Burton on Trent.At one point he winds up on a Filipino crewed box boat and it sounds like a miserable existance,I wouldn`t like to go back at all.


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## Leratty

Alan I thought your initial response was spot on, also I believe there were a few parties at sea (younger) in the 60's who saw the writing on the wall & went for a different career if they could as they could see their life choice, or in my case a sabbatical before university was going through major changes. Would not in the main have missed it for the world. Sadly youngsters can not have such a interesting experience with all the travel, people you met etc now days I suggest?
Must say thought Keltic Star got a tad bilious there who had the funds or knew how to raise them to acquire a vessel vessels flag them in Panama et al & make that elusive fortune let alone even want to?
Happy days with those memories, Richard


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## Leratty

Garry, a ship inspector in Solomon Islands, JC interesting position? I can recall those seriously scary ferries that went between Honiara & Gizo + all in-between in the 70-80's, beyond belief still can smell the raw sewerage sloshing backwards & forwards on main deck ): Am surprised in hind-site that there were never any Philippines style sinkings with accompanying huge loss of life. Heard that an old Sydney ferry is up there now days? Still a great place with fond memories,particularly the wreck diving with Reg Thomas the salvage guy based in Honiara & that crazy yacht club on the beach, along with the Mandana Hotel whose food was 1950's UK boarding school stodge as it was run for many years by a old retired Brit civil servant & his amusing eccentric wife who came out of Africa somewhere when they got independence & could not go back to real world wonder what happened to them?
Richard


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## garry Norton

In my 3years in the Solomons we only lost 2 people at sea, both Brits, 1 was carried overboard when he tried to get a bucket of water from the sea from a moving launch and the other trying to land from a surf boat with big boots on.Our ships may have been schooner rigged but were all inspected annually and made as sea-worthy as possible even allowing bamboo lifejackets on coastal craft.We had several occasions of divers damaging eardrums by diving to depths over 100feet on 2nd World War Wrecks.Also war time bombs were collected and exploded for reef passages.We did not have radar and travelled to all the islands, the Marine Crews were locally trained. I was there from May 1970 to December 1973, leaving on my own account.


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## Troppo

Greetings from Honiara!

I have worked here, on and off, for quite a few years.

The yachtie is just as crazy as it was....had a beer with an old navy mate there the other night....


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## Troppo

Oh, and the Mendana is much better...


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## Leratty

Troppo, yes the yacht club was a place to enjoy that is for sure. Not too sure if the honesty is still there with the locals, hopefully so? I in a state of total inebriation staggered back to the charming Mendana without my Nikon cameras, lenses, flashes etc one evening. Did not realise until next day much to my horror. Reg put the word out within hours all returned, AMAZING as worth even then several thousands AU$'s. Are the Solomon's still with Aus/NZ troops-police there or has it lifted out of its problems? We have been there many times always loved it. We remember a politician getting into a fist fight in the China town sector one night at dinner, JC imagine that in Canberra.... still brings a smile to my face thinking of it. Keep on enjoying it as it is a special place.
Richard


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## Leratty

Hi Garry, we would have been without doubt the first of the sport divers there am sure. Hired Reg Thomas for the first trip to dive WW2 wrecks, it was a revelation as so untouched except by the 60's Aus/NZ salvors. One of whom we met later in Espiritu Santo, Alan Powers (wonder if he is still alive?) diving the Pres Coolidge, what a top guy & diver. Now that was a serious deep dive-penetration scary at times. We were diving serious depths then too 150'+ only with tables too, twice a day. Did 220' in Rabaul harbour (what a beautiful place before the volcanic explosion) on a sub mother ship which I had the most scary dive incident I ever experienced. Man looking back that was either foolish confidence or just plain mad keen. Also dived of course the beached wrecks, did you ever dive the Japanese sub that brought the midgets to Sydney? It was sunk I believe by a Kiwi corvette via ramming? We had to pay a local village chief then swim out around a reef about three klms each way, then dive around I recall 70-90'? We penetrated her & took heaps of photos. She still had to our shock the crew on board which was the first though not last time we came across that, quite eerie. She had had her bunkers salvaged & the prop too by Reg & Alan et all. I was using B&W film with a fish eye lens at times, the pic's are something. We dived several trips all the way up to Gizo, many Japanese & US aircraft, walked the island that Pres Kennedy swam to with his crew, amazing times. Took our boat up there in the early 80's & dived some real out of the way places & wrecks. Reckon no one else has or will. How the.... did the Brit die with his boots on if you were landing in surf? Could he not have come to the surface surf or not & swum to shore as recall water was like glass most of the time? Maybe his boots were tied on rather than laced? Why boots I muse? Did you know Reg whilst you were there? Lovely guy & terrific wife as well as children. Your experience with the schooners etc would have been superb. get hold of me via the private chat line & we could have a laugh about those times if you like. Happy days from Asia.


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## garry Norton

Hi Leratty,
Yes N.Z. Police are still there, one of our local police has just come back from there. He enjoyed it but said Honiara is quite dirty these days. I keep having him on that they have more Aust/N.Z. police there these days than the pre-independance there were ex-patriot civil servants many of them being Fijian, Australian and New Zealanders all on short term ODA contracts, the Brits were mainly P&P contracts which were pensionable. Us colonials were not pensionable.
I enjoyed my time there.I also spent some time in Gizo, while there one of my jobs was to find Pres Kennedy's P.T. boat, all we found was some old engine remains.


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## Troppo

Yes, the cops and Army are still here.

It is indeed very dirty in town. 

The buai spit stains are as lovely as ever....


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## garry Norton

To Troppo
Is my old house still standing, it was next to the Honiara lighthouse and was made from packing cases and on stilts.


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## Leratty

Garry did you get to the old British Consul's holiday house on Gizo up on the hill? It was run by I recall on both occasions we were there a couple from Aus/UK who were using it as a BnB, never had any guests only a couple of Dr's or war time visitors. Would have been a lovely house in its day. There was a bar on the water too, can't remember its name. It was run by a loopy Belgian + a real character collecting the sea cu***bers & exporting them. His wife was apparently enjoying herself elsewhere...): We flew out leaving the boat for a couple of months from the airport on a little island nearby, still recall the flying pretty hairy some of the places we landed going out then back to take boat on. They were pretty good pilots mostly Aus /NZ even if very young must say. There is here an English guy who was a Methodist missionary up there in the 60's/70's he was 19 then. He tells some classic Gizo/Melanesian stories. Ironically he now restores classic cars, bit of a change of vocation? Do you reckon those engine remains were PT109's, doubt it as they would not have had their position plotted that accurately then? There was an interesting plane wreck just off that island Pres swam to it almost intact. We got some good pic's of it.


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## Leratty

Troppo the beetle nut stains were worse in New Britain as I recall Rabaul pavements were shocking. The accuracy of the spitter though was just amazing could get a trash can on a lamp post from close to 4m. Kinda, like I imagine in the days of chewing tobacco or spittoons. Also the local people were better looking too.


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## garry Norton

Leratty
When I was in Gizo it was under Britain and there was a District Officer in charge. I stopped in the Co-ops officer house while he was on leave.It was a large wooden place and a water tank which you pumped up by hand each day, the cooking was by kerosine stove.I was up there setting up commercial accounting for the marine department which to the surprise of everyone made a profit which you are not supposed to do in government.It was easy give the people what they want.We also ran the boat to the airport a little launch with a diesel with a top speed of 6 knots.Great fishing on the reef. The Palmers had some cows for beef and the catholic bishop used to do the hair cutting.


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## Leratty

Garry you could have been there when Richard the missionary I was mentioning was up there? Very tall blond Pom, nice guy, great raconteur, he will be for sure in the bar tonight. Asked how the Brit could die with his boots on, what happened there? Did you come across Reg he would have been there when you were? We were there first in early, mid 70's + late 70's, then again in late 80's with the boat. A wry smile crossed my face with the "profit made"comment, how true, not normal that is for sure. Was that engine-s you found PT109's? There was a magnificent dive we named Grand Central Station which was at the opening of the lagoon reef. You dived it six mins before & six minutes after high-low tide, i.e. twelve minute dive as any time after current too strong. The fish we saw from walls of Hammerhead to white tip, Barracuda by the score & all other types down the chain they were sometimes ten metres + deep, scores of them going in on high tide & out on low tide. We would sit with backs to the reef at about twelve metres down, awe inspiring. Some Garry would be within six to eight metres of you their eyes looking as the went past. Without doubt one of the significant series of dives we have ever made anywhere. Would love to have known our breathing & heart rate...ah prior to computers sadly. I still have the dive charts with positions of our dives + GPS plots from the boat so locating the sites again would be quite easy. We have been diving Myanmar & Viet Nam over last few years a few wrecks in in former but mostly wall & reef diving. We dive Palau & Chuk (ex Truk) moderately regularly & have done Bikini or Kwajalein twice. The latter is where the Prinz Eugen (was with Bismark on her last voyage) is lying, some dive too she is upside down.


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## Troppo

The water viz in Gizo is a good as ever....you can still stand on the wharf and see the bottom.

SI is a beautiful country...it would have been really lovely when the Brits ran it.

Much safer than PNG. You can walk the streets in Honiara, no worries.


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## Leratty

Quite right Troppo, we visit PNG on coffee buying trips twice a year & in the last three to four years it has become, though it was never safe even in the 70's, scary, especially if you have a woman with you, just too dangerous. How did it occur I wonder, was it Aus administration, what? Port Moresby is seriously 'rascal' populated, last time we were there got a taxi to the hotel from airport & fair go there was no back seat, I am serious! Madang is still OK safe etc but do not know anywhere else there. The clarity of the water up in Solomon's was beyond belief I recall viz of over 100'when diving, same, same Rabaul until the volcanic eruption. Yes SI are beautiful & the people are truly delightful so in a way naive almost child like at times. Nope can not say the same about PNG sadly. In Madang at night you can not catch a cab outside the town limits unless the driver was of the same tribe as territory you were to pass through as they feared being beaten up, f..... if I know what would have happened to us so we used to stay often overnight at Madang Hotel to be safe after 10pm. Speaking of safety & a population in crisis we have just been in Saana, Yemen's capital & yes all would say you are NUTS considering what is occurring with Arab Spring. Correct it can be unsafe being a westerner (Muslim country) due to the many armed rebels + troops along with anti US sentiment however our clients always keep us in the know even when we were out in the countryside. An experience let me tell you & the food is brilliant let alone the coffee & tea.


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## Troppo

Ha ha! I have worked in PNG, on and off, for the last 30 years.

You were MAD getting a taxi in Moresby, mate!


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## garry Norton

leratty
I have put a web site a the bottom of this that may be of interest, it was written by one of the malaria officers that was there with me.
The chap that drowned with his boots on occurred in the Eastern Outer Islands and he was pulled under when the surf boat capsized on landing in a undertow.
I did not meet your friend in Gizo,I was only up there for 2 months.The engine remains we found was probably PT109 as it was in the right area.
I also in 1998 spent several months in Lae working for SGS and could not wait to get out of there as tax was 52% and roits in the main street.
In my travels I also piloted in Yeman upsetting Yeman/Hunt as I did not like the way they worked cutting corners.



http://antbase.org/ants/africa/personal/solomons/sols1.html


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## Leratty

Oh Troppo, mate, mate what does one do as a vastly experienced PNG man, do tell? You can not get a hire car to pick you up as far as we know & there are no 'safe' buses either, walk, na that is even more dangerous, so how does a man of your experience get from airport to down town? For sure a Mad Max place Moresby. Some seriously troubled expats in that neck of the woods makes those of like state in Asia look normal  Ah the rich tapestry of life Troppo keep on enjoying your times in PNG.


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## Leratty

Hi Garry, sadly that web page does not open seems that it is redirected then again does not open? Lae we have not been for many years since way back in early 80's, was a pretty place with great diving. Happily have never experienced a riot in PNG, no wish to either! I was at Ok Tedi for a while in my previous life/biz, some interesting stories from that project too. Thank God I was just consulting turned out to be window dressing anyway. How they got away with the environmental shambles which will be affecting the locals for generations to come is anyone's guess. JC that Brit was unlucky as the undertows can be vicious. What a shame you could not get those PT109 engines up or bits thereof as they could go straight to Smithsonian I reckon. Yemen, are you speaking of ship piloting or aircraft? We fly Ethiopian Air, HK Addas then same into Saana, trip before last they told us they could not guarantee they could get us out...made us sit up & think let me tell you ): they did though. Must say we think they are a very good airline, better safety wise than some of those SI-PNG flights & planes all modern-new too.


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## garry Norton

Ship piloting at Ras Essa onto FPSO Safer. When I went to Yeman I flew out on Yeman Air Flight and passed through Lanica airport the same time the Kuwait Air Plane was highjacked, we went in blacked out and away the same.The flight Sanna to Houdada was local, walk in the back and walk off the same way no seat numbers or check for knives , guns were check in jobs.


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## Leratty

Still no as we know it real X-ray or search of bags carry on or other in Yemen. Quite disconcerting though reckon if someone wishes to they will get what they require on board anywhere. Flights out of Chuk-Yap akin your Houdada, still no seat No's allocated. Can be amusing as you could have a large fish beside you or small pig, bird, bags of smelly shell fish etc. Total free for all getting aboard as well as disembarking, to hell with ******  Hmm to be that close to hijacking, there but for the ........go us I reckon at times. Sun for the first time in seven days, blue sky too, man that is unusual for here.


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## garry Norton

Sent you some photos via e-mail, the web site seems to have gone with time.


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## Troppo

Leratty said:


> Oh Troppo, mate, mate what does one do as a vastly experienced PNG man, do tell? You can not get a hire car to pick you up as far as we know & there are no 'safe' buses either, walk, na that is even more dangerous, so how does a man of your experience get from airport to down town? For sure a Mad Max place Moresby. Some seriously troubled expats in that neck of the woods makes those of like state in Asia look normal  Ah the rich tapestry of life Troppo keep on enjoying your times in PNG.


Ha ha!

Get a mate to pick you up. If that is not possible, get a shuttle bus from one of the major hotels....

Oh yes.... missionaries, mercenaries and misfits indeed...


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## trotterdotpom

I suspect a "mercenary" tastes like a marinated "missionary".

John T


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## Alex Salmond

alan ward said:


> Speaking of sons,any of you lads in Auckland?call in at my boy Neils cafe on Beach Road,he sells Staffordshire Oatcakes for those of you who have never had the pleasure it`s also known as the Tunstall Tortilla,Chell Chapatti or the Burslem Burrito a silky,soft piece of wonder wrapped around a filling of your choice.Some of the oddities you Kiwis order worries me a little but try grilled bacon and melted cheese,you know it makes sense.Look him up on FB it`s under Original Staffordshire Oatcakes.This has been a public service announcement.


Hi Alan,
Im in Auckland mate and would gladly give your lad some of my hard earned South Sea shekels but as there are several Beach Roads in this tropical paradise which one might it be ,im picking its the one in the city but(?HUH) and oddities Kiwis eat ?? this from a man who lives in a country where mushy peas are considered haute cuisine please(*))


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## 40907

Troppo said:


> _Flag of Necessity_
> 
> What lovely spin....


Emphasis on "spin"? Those at the top make more and more while those doing the work.... Status quo is just not what it used to be!


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## 40907

Alex Salmond said:


> Hi Alan,
> Im in Auckland mate and would gladly give your lad some of my hard earned South Sea shekels but as there are several Beach Roads in this tropical paradise which one might it be ,im picking its the one in the city but(?HUH) and oddities Kiwis eat ?? this from a man who lives in a country where mushy peas are considered haute cuisine please(*))


Ooo!! You are a one, Alex! LOVE it!! (Applause) [=D]


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## Klaatu83

A.D.FROST said:


> In a word "CONTAINERISATION"


Absolutely correct, containerization changed everything. What has gone forever is the opportunity to enjoy the life of a seaman. I came in on the tail-end of the era when general cargo ships tied up for days, sometimes for more than a week, in ports where you could literally walk into town. Now we tie up at at container terminals, all of which are pretty much the same, for no more than a few hectic, work-filled hours. Twelve hours in port is considered a long stay these days. The terminals are usually so big that you can't even walk to the gate, and if you could the terminal won't allow you to anyway. Even if you had the time to spare, many of the terminals won't even provide any means transportation to get to the gate. In any case, it is usually ten miles from the terminal gate to the nearest anywhere, and hardly anybody on the ships ever has the time to make the trip anymore. It's not unusual to spend months on a container ship and never set foot off the ship at all.

Another thing that has changed since 1989 (directly after the Exxon Valdez went aground) is the constant round of required drug testing. That has weeded out a lot of the bad apples, but it's also thrown a damper on life at sea for the rest of us. Even the ships officers are now also required to be qualified to administer drug tests, and even alcohol breathalyzer tests, to their crews. As a result, gone are the days of "Jolly Jack Tar" getting pissed ashore and rolling back aboard just in time for sailing. Nowadays, that sort of behavior is grounds for instant dismissal.


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