# Common Law Marriages at Sea



## jmcg (Apr 20, 2008)

Has any S/N member ever officiated or attended a marriage at sea under common law?


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## gdynia (Nov 3, 2005)

Not at sea but the Seamans Mission Bus in Great Yarmouth


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## jmcg (Apr 20, 2008)

Tell us more!

J.


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## jmcg (Apr 20, 2008)

Re post #3

I rather suspect same gender arrangements would not be a common law marriage celebrated by a Master of a British registered vessel.

For a marriage to be at "Common Law" at sea it would have to be conducted by the Master. It would have legal standing. Merely shacking up or living BOT does not confer married status irrespective of gender. This applies to shore side arrangements too.

Sorry!

J.


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## Pat Hughes (Sep 23, 2008)

Surely that would only apply on a British Ship.


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## Coastie (Aug 24, 2005)

There was the marriage between DJ Mick Lovzit and his Bride on the MV Caroline in Ramsey Bay in the mid 60's which thousands of listeners witnessed!

Does that count?


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## jmcg (Apr 20, 2008)

Coastie said:


> There was the marriage between DJ Mick Lovzit and his Bride on the MV Caroline in Ramsey Bay in the mid 60's which thousands of listeners witnessed!
> 
> Does that count?


Yes that one was valid.

J.


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## Coastie (Aug 24, 2005)

In that case, count me in as I heard it, even though I was about 6!

The Bride was the Sister of fellow DJ "Ugly" Ray Terret.


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## gdynia (Nov 3, 2005)

Coastie just because we are parked up in your neck of the woods that does not make us engaged especially with that Samuri hairstyle


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## surfaceblow (Jan 16, 2008)

On the USNS Gilliland we had a Marriage on the Bridge while we were at the dock. We had a Priest come onboard to Officiate the Marriage. The Captain wore his Dress Blues all I could do was to put on my suit and tie. The AB and his Bride along with the assemble guest and crew thought it was great.


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## lakercapt (Jul 19, 2005)

Several times I was asked about this and the truth of the matter is that the ships master CANNOT marry anyone. He can act as a register if the marriage is performed by an ordained clergy.
To lighten the disappointment told the participants that I could but it was only valid for the voyage.
Wonder how many members wished that had been the case!!!!!


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## Gulpers (Sep 8, 2005)

gdynia said:


> Coastie just because we are parked up in your neck of the woods that does not make us engaged especially with that Samuri hairstyle


Come on Neville, you can’t be *that* desperate already – just remind me, how many days have you been Rhyl so far? (Jester)


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## gdynia (Nov 3, 2005)

Ray we have been watching the lights ashore now for 7 nights now not done a stroke of work with this weather and does not look like we will before next Tuesday


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## Gulpers (Sep 8, 2005)

I don't think you are wrong there Neville - the forecast is atrocious. 
Still doesn't explain your infatuation with Coastie though! I'm getting a wee bit worried about you! (Jester)


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## Enri (Jun 24, 2008)

If I recall correctly, my Liberian Masters Cert would have allowed me to conduct a marriage, though not the British.
I think American masters can marry people as well, the Liberian certificate being based on the US one.

Enri


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## notnila (Apr 26, 2006)

So I suppose across the Crew Mess table on a "Flattie" in North Shields doesn't count then????


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## trotterdotpom (Apr 29, 2005)

Thanks Lakercapt - you beat me to it. This subject has been aired before and Peter 4447 was a mine of information, I seem to recall.

The term "Common Law Marriage" refers to a couple who live together without being married officially - more often known as "de facto" these days. There used to be lots of names for it, eg "living over the brush", but they've died out now that the practice is so widespread.

John T.


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## Andy Lavies (Feb 12, 2006)

As Lakercapt says "Marriages performed by the Captain are valid only for the duration of the voyage." When you are Captain of the Isle of Wight ferry the consumation needs to be fairly prompt!

Andy


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## NoMoss (Mar 14, 2007)

Andy Lavies said:


> As Lakercapt says "Marriages performed by the Captain are valid only for the duration of the voyage." When you are Captain of the Isle of Wight ferry the consumation needs to be fairly prompt!
> 
> Andy


The Sealink ferry Earl Granville had a notice on the Bridge to that affect - we could never get anyone to participate in the ceremony!


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## NoMoss (Mar 14, 2007)

Andy Lavies said:


> As Lakercapt says "Marriages performed by the Captain are valid only for the duration of the voyage." When you are Captain of the Isle of Wight ferry the consumation needs to be fairly prompt!
> 
> Andy


Especially on the Fast Cats! (15 minutes or so).


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## sidsal (Nov 13, 2007)

There is a tale of the matelot who with his girlfriend called on the Vicar and asked him to marry them there and then. The Vicar explained he could'nt do that as they there wou;d have to be banns and residency requirements etc.
The disappointed matelot said - " Couldn't you just say a few words to see us over the weekend !!"

And there is the tale of the matelot and his new bride walking down the aisle after being wed and the bride saying - "O, Harry, ain't it going to be wonderful tonight ?"
"Wot jer mean tonight ?" he replied - " This arternoon " !!


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## randcmackenzie (Aug 31, 2005)

Lakercapt has it right, the Master on a British ship could act as Registrar when the marriage was performed by an authorised person.

The Master on a Liberian ship could actually perform the ceremony, and in fact I sailed with a Chief Engineer and his wife who had got married in this way.


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## Ray Mac (Sep 22, 2007)

R651400 said:


> Did on Iberia in Sydney circa 59 between two catering staff consenting adults of the same gendre...


Nice Boys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1(Jester)


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## John Briggs (Feb 12, 2006)

Patrick Fitzgerald and Gerald Fitzpatrick if I remember correctly!


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## Bill Davies (Sep 5, 2007)

Behave yourself John.


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## lakercapt (Jul 19, 2005)

The Master on a Liberian ship could actually perform the ceremony, and in fact I sailed with a Chief Engineer and his wife who had got married in this way.[/QUOTE]

Looked at my "Liberian" certificate and I did not see anywhere that this was mentioned but I wished I had the opportunity to have performed a marriage as death I had entered into the official log.


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## randcmackenzie (Aug 31, 2005)

Lakercapt, it was in the Liberian Articles or Regulations somewhere, though I can't remember where.


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## Bill Davies (Sep 5, 2007)

randcmackenzie said:


> Lakercapt, it was in the Liberian Articles or Regulations somewhere, though I can't remember where.


When you find out let me know as I was never aware of it. Or maybe I was just too busy to read the Liberian Articles or Regulations.

Bill


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## Nigel Wing (Sep 26, 2006)

It was my duty to give the bride away, on the vessel Astart, there is a good picture of that occasion in my gallery, the Captain performed the service, and a good day was enjoyed by all.
Whether it was a legal marriage or not, I cannot recall.
Cheers
Nigel.


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## John Briggs (Feb 12, 2006)

Nigel,

Legal for the duration of the voyage only!


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## Chris Isaac (Jul 29, 2006)

Under English and Welsh law there is no such thing as Common Law!


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## Lancastrian (Feb 8, 2006)

Chris Isaac said:


> Under English and Welsh law there is no such thing as Common Law!


I think you meant to say there is no such thing as Common Law Marriages. Common Law is the basis of all our law.


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## trotterdotpom (Apr 29, 2005)

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, the term "common law marriage" means a couple co-habiting without the benefit of a legally binding ceremony. The term goes back to the middle ages and I believe it distinguishes this type of "marriage" from one solemnified under "canon law", ie in a church.

John T.


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## Lancastrian (Feb 8, 2006)

trotterdotpom said:


> As I mentioned earlier in this thread, the term "common law marriage" means a couple co-habiting without the benefit of a legally binding ceremony. The term goes back to the middle ages and I believe it distinguishes this type of "marriage" from one solemnified under "canon law", ie in a church.
> 
> John T.


Yes, but in some countries including Scotland until quite recently, such cohabitations were legally recognised as marriage. They have not been so in England since the Marriage Act of 1753.


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## Old Janner (Mar 11, 2009)

Have not heard the "BOT marrage" term used for many years, brought back some memories of South Shields, there were a lot of BOT wives there!


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## Old Janner (Mar 11, 2009)

Nearly forgot, the main venue at that time was Ridges Estate. Though I am sure there were a few in North Shields as well, I remember a few early mornings getting kicked out of bed to go to work on my ship in Palmers Yard.


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## 7woodlane (Apr 20, 2009)

Another view of marriages at sea can be got from :
P and O cruises wedding site. Terms and conditions, the FAQs item three on legal requirements.


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## Naytikos (Oct 20, 2008)

randcmackenzie is quite correct: the master of a liberian ship may perform a statutory marriage IF this has first been registered by the relevant authority in Liberia (or a Liberian consul). This is akin to posting banns. 
Blank marriage certificates are not amongst the many liberian forms required to be carried aboard ship, but a master can get them from a consulate or, by advance notice, from a liberian maritime inspector.
Also like Lakercapt, I haven't done it either, but have recorded a birth and death.


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## smithax (Jul 16, 2009)

Marrying on Liberian Ships regulations are :
Liberian Maritime Law Section 297 authorizes the Master to marry passengers or other persons aboard when a vessel is at sea in international waters. In accordance with Regulation 10.297, each exercise of the special power granted to the Master shall be evidenced by appropriate certificate, referring to a logbook entry of the event, and signed by the Master and executed by the Commissioner or a Deputy Commissioner of Maritime Affairs. The couple is married at the time of the ceremony with the subsequent issuance of the official certificate, which will indicate the date of marriage, thereby confirming the date on which the ceremony occurred. 


The official (sealed) certificate issued to evidence the marriage is "self authenticating" and does not require notarization. Marriages conducted by the Master of a Liberian flag vessel are performed under authority of the Liberian Maritime Law and are recognized under the laws of the Republic of Liberia as valid marriages. Liberian marriages, like Algerian, Australian, Brazilian, British, Canadian, Chinese, Egyptian, French, German, Indian, Kenyan, Malaysian, Nigerian, South African, etc. marriages performed according to the respective country's customs and procedures, are recognized and given full faith and credit in jurisdictions around the world including the United States. Liberian marriages have been performed on board passenger and non-passenger vessels.


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## Ulf Harrison (Jun 13, 2005)

What about divorce? It would be great if this could be sorted out that easily. Especially before go on leave.


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## Thats another Story (Mar 4, 2009)

It used to be called liveing over the brush(Hippy)


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## Ulf Harrison (Jun 13, 2005)

Good point. I should have left out “Especially before go on leave”


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## CAPTAIN JEREMY (Mar 9, 2010)

*Marriage*



Enri said:


> If I recall correctly, my Liberian Masters Cert would have allowed me to conduct a marriage, though not the British.
> I think American masters can marry people as well, the Liberian certificate being based on the US one.
> 
> Enri


It depends on the flag state. Liberia recognises the legality of a marriage performed by the master, as does Panama. When I am asked if I can marry passengers, I reply that my wife wont let me!!


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