# Poor HF reception on 16 - 28MHz band



## Paul Braxton (Jul 21, 2005)

My Atalanta rx is pretty well dead on the above band. No bcast stations, no time signal from WWVH, just static. Is anyone aware of the possibility of sunspot or other solar event which might be causing this? Or is anyone having similar problems, I wonder?

Could be that the set itself is going down the tubes. It's pretty ancient, but has always worked perfectly and is still going great guns on the lower bands, including AM bcast and 2MHz, even, picking up Aussie wx fcsts from inland NZ at night. 

At first I wondered if it might be an AE pblm, but that can't be the case in view of the above. Any clues anyone?

Can't promise a case of beer nowadays for any assistance, but the thought is there.

Paul


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## R651400 (Jun 18, 2005)

Comparing the Atalanta with any web SDR near your location hould provide the answer.


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## GW3OQK (Jun 10, 2010)

Paul, it's like that with me at the moment above 16 MHz. Some strange noises and a few weak stations in 17 and 21 MHz broadcast bands. Fairly lively on the next band down. 
73, Andrew


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## sparks69 (Dec 18, 2005)

I understood the word "Atalanta" but the rest .......
Please elucidate.


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## Paul Braxton (Jul 21, 2005)

GW3OQK: Hi from NZ (assume you are in UK?)

I'm not getting as much activity on 14MHz either, come to that. 7MHz ham stuff is down, but still something there after dark. I reckon it could be the set itself in my case, as it has an unknown pedigree and of quite an age, by the look of it. When I bought it off a guy, he had it sitting on his garage floor, covered in dust, etc., but it came up beautifully after a clean. Worked well for the four or five years I've had it, but no spares to try out different RF valves now.
Thanks for your comments.

Sparks69: not sure if you're winding me up, but it may not be in reply to my post. 

I'm not sure, in fact I don't know, what SDR refers to online? Maybe you're referring to that post?


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## tunatownshipwreck (Nov 9, 2005)

You can look at current solar/geomagnetic conditions at www.solen.info/solar and http://spaceweather.com


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## J. Davies (Dec 29, 2010)

HF conditions are the worst for many years. We are at the bottom of the cycle and this one has had the lowest number of sunspots since radio started. Bands below 14 MHz are still usable after dark but the higher bands are dead, apart from the occasional freak burst of propagation. That said, the big broadcast stations should be audible with their huge transmitters.


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## Paul Braxton (Jul 21, 2005)

Thanks for that, guys. Looks as if it may not be my rx after all then. Good job, 'cos I don't have any test gear or spares, apart from an AVO, although I do have the manual (and it's intact!)

Keep an ear out and see if it changes anytime soon.


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## sparks69 (Dec 18, 2005)

Paul Braxton said:


> GW3OQK: Hi from NZ (assume you are in UK?)
> 
> I'm not getting as much activity on 14MHz either, come to that. 7MHz ham stuff is down, but still something there after dark. I reckon it could be the set itself in my case, as it has an unknown pedigree and of quite an age, by the look of it. When I bought it off a guy, he had it sitting on his garage floor, covered in dust, etc., but it came up beautifully after a clean. Worked well for the four or five years I've had it, but no spares to try out different RF valves now.
> Thanks for your comments.
> ...



No not a wind up sorry if it came out that way.
I was a radio op for 20 years and in that time 22/26 MHz came & went. 17Mhz was the best for Dx during the day. With the single man watch keeping (2 on 2 off then off all night) HF was to me an unreliable method of long range communication. Yes it worked but nothing like the Sat Com I had for the last 3 weeks of my R/O career !
Someone must have plotted the effectiveness of 17/22/25 MHz from the time it started to be used to the end of the R/O era.
I would be interested in that.


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## R651400 (Jun 18, 2005)

Internet SDRs (Software Defined Radio) are dotted around the world. Try *here .*...


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## david.hopcroft (Jun 29, 2005)

Reception on my Lowe HF235 is also very poor at present. I don't have a brilliant aerial system, but nothing much to hear at present. 

I thought that SDR was Special Drawing Rights, which was a sort of universal currency charge for telegrams ?


David
+


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## Manchester (Feb 24, 2011)

My memory of SDR is situation display radar. Marconi I think


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## GBXZ (Nov 4, 2008)

SDR radar.
Kelvin Hughes.


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## Varley (Oct 1, 2006)

Photoplot?


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## sparks69 (Dec 18, 2005)

Don't mention Photoplot..........................


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## Ron Stringer (Mar 15, 2005)

Varley said:


> Photoplot?


You are showing your age David. Both K-H but Situation Display came far later.


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## Varley (Oct 1, 2006)

Perhaps the old dog waited until they came up with a real corker. I had the immense pleasure (and considerable struggle internally) to get a Sharpeye as one of the last tasks before I was scrapped. I did see a Photoplot when working some of a long leave out of Eastham depot. It seemed to make a Radiolocator (not the new which I did sail with later, and the only S band of the line at that time but the 1970s version). Pleased we didn't use chemicals except for cleaning!


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## King Ratt (Aug 23, 2005)

Sailed with an SDR radar in RFA Olwen. Dreadful device.


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## majoco (Oct 15, 2008)

Another greetings from NZ! Agreed with all said above - anything above the 19m band is very quiet - even the NZ stations that used to boom in during the daytime are down in the the noise - Auckland aero on 8867kHz from me in Palmerston North for instance, although Nadi on the same frequency is often good. After dark it's not so bad and the lower frequency bands are still better - some good catches on the 49m band. Have you tried a new valve in the RF stage of the Atalanta (EF86?) - I've had a couple of those go out when I was in the Merch in the 60's. I can send you a scan of the spectrum from 2 to 30MHz at a random selection of times if you'd like. My test to see if everything is working is to see if I can get the beacon from Port MacQuarie PMQ on 395kHz and Merrimbula ME underneath him on the same frequency.

JRC NRD515, Skanti R5000, Winradio G33DDC and a few others through a proper multicoupler from an "Off-centre fed delta sloping loop".


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## djringjr (Feb 11, 2008)

SDR is software defined radio. These days you can remote control received from around the world: https://sdr.hu/ Try searching for KPH HF as they have a medium wave and a shortwave unit.

David
N1EA 

Ex Tuckerton Radio WSC


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## Paul Braxton (Jul 21, 2005)

Thanks for your comments, Majoco. No, I haven't got any spares for the valves in the Atalanta, but I guess they would be available online somewhere. Thanks for the tip. Auckland Aero and sometimes Nadi were booming in a few months back, but nothing but noise on their frequency now (or at least the last time I had the set on, which was about 3 weeks back). I get QRM from the laptop which is in the same room, so have to shut it down when I'm on the radio, which is a pain. Think it's picking up via the mains line, as it's a lot quieter when the laptop is on battery, though then I've got a widescreen Samsung monitor putting out QRM as well.

I will have a QSX for PMQ, but it seemed to have been fine on the MF or low MF bands, as well as the bcast AM band. Whereabouts in NZ are you? I'm at a place called Kaharoa, which is just north of Rotorua, out in the quiet of the sticks, and high up, to boot, at around 420 metres elevation.

Regards, Paul


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## Paul Braxton (Jul 21, 2005)

WSC! Wow, there's a blast from the past. Worked that station a few times, usually only with OBS tfc. Nice, powerful station, if I remember rightly. Thanks for your info re SDR. I've tried one online version after I got to hear of it for the first time a few days back. Impressive stuff.


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## spaarks (May 1, 2009)

*HF Reception tools*

Here are a couple of links to propagation predictions.

http://www.voacap.com/radcom/
https://soundbytes.asia/proppy/
http://www.predtest.uk/

I haven't used them extensively. They look a bit optimistic, but I live in an apartment where there is a lot of QRN - I suspect a lot of it from LED lighting.

73s
Denis GI3TAC


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## majoco (Oct 15, 2008)

Hi Paul, I'm in Ashhurst, a small village about 15km from Palmerston North in the Manawatu. Now that I live alone, I have complete control over the computers and TV's so the QRM is not so much of a problem, although I believe a neighbour has a plasma TV! I make up my own antennas and baluns to keep a lot of noise out but I found the laptop chargers make more noise than anything else, some LCD displays and printer power supplies too. Anything with a switch-mode power supply is suspect.

WSL, WCC and WSC - the most used coast stations on the US East coast - apart from CFH!

Best 73.


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## freddythefrog (Dec 15, 2007)

FOR PAUL BRAXTON.
Hi Paul
Speaking to a colleague of mine who used to repair/service the Ships Atalanta
receivers in GTZM Liverpool workshops he tells me there was a STOCK FAULT
on these receivers and he found that the common screen feed resistor to the 
2 R/F valves used to go open circuit . Sorry i dont have a cct diagram myself
but you can probably find it ok on yours and replace the resistor and see what happens, he did say it gave the symptoms you have but its worth changing
anyway. I also do know that the band conditions are pretty bad at present moment in time.Good luck with it Paul. Cheers 73.s de ftf


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## Paul Braxton (Jul 21, 2005)

Thanks Freddy, for that gem of information.

I can't get over how useful this site really is. Who'd have thought, someone who knows someone from Mimco who actually has the know-how on the old Atalanta! That is truly amazing.

I do have the manual for it, so will do as you suggest, see what happens. I replaced the two RF amps with new valves and there does seem to be an improvement, although not a huge one. As you say, it could be down in part, at least, to propagation conditions. Let you know how I get on, once I get my hands on the appropriate resistor, that is.

Regards, and thanks, Paul


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## Paul Braxton (Jul 21, 2005)

Martin! (#24)... Didn't see your post, all the way from the Manawatu. Sorry, but 73's to you, too. CFH was Halifax, N.S., wasn't it? Good work with your aerials and so forth. I wouldn't have the knowledge, now, to know how to do all that.

Freddy (#25)... Changed the 22k high stab resistor (R100), in the screen feed for V1 and V2, a nice little job, getting my hands down and dirty inside the old set. (Actually, she's in near perfect condition inside, no sign of any dirt, cobwebs or the like, and all joints still in factory mode, all with the signature red mark on each soldered joint). A bit hard to melt the old solder at first, but not having a high wattage iron, I have to 'start it' with fresh solder, then it's O.K. When I removed the old R100 and put it on the AVO to test, found out that I'd have to fix my test equipment first! Battery compartment problems, leakage from a D cell in there had spread a solid encrustation of beautifully blue-coloured crystals everywhere. Could hardly even scrape it off, so had to dismantle the entire meter, now on the work bench awaiting further work today. My little digital meter, unused for many years, still seemed to be working enough, although intermittently, showing the original resistor at what seemed to still be 22k. 

Replaced it anyway, and now I seem to be getting far better reception on the two 'top' bands - 6 to 15MHz and 15 to 28MHz. The latter band has been virtually silent for many months, with only very strong b'cast signals coming through at night, but now there's a lot going on again, all the way along to the top end. Picking up the air traffic HF from Nandi, Brisbane and Auckland again, as well as the aircraft themselves on 8MHz. last night. Not at all sure what part varying propagation conditions may be playing here, but I suspect that the new RF valves and now a new screen resistor has been the main factor in the better performance.

Interesting, too, in the fact that the SSB signals from the above sources, as well as amateurs, don't seem to drift nearly as much as they always have done since I first had the set. I was able to leave the air traffic frequency and go and have tea last night, listening to whatever came on over the TV sound in the lounge, and blow me down, the set seemed hardly to drift at all. In fact, the voices were still coming through virtually with the same degree of intelligibility as at the start. Previously, I would have had to sit there, twiddling the fine tuning control virtually constantly, just to maintain intelligibility. Whether that's anything to do with the earthing on the tuning caps or not is not known, but I suppose might well be.

Anyway, thanks again for your ideas on that, and thanks to your friend, too, for his recollection of a stock fault from Mimco days. I would love to know the history of my set, whether it was ever on a ship, and if so, which, as well as how old it is. There's no mod label, and the Marconi metal name badge contains the name Atalanta integrally within it, not separately, on a black rectangle underneath, as the newer ones had in my recollection. I have a photo of one on the old "Icenic"/GHHH, which had what I think must have been the newer badging, and that dated from late '74, so I have a clue there that maybe my RX dates back to before that era. Don't suppose there's any way of finding out, there probably not being any records still extant.

But thanks again for your interest, and giving me the chance to do some real work again with a soldering iron and a set built to last forever-more, it seems.

73's from Kaharoa, NZ. Best regards, Paul


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## freddythefrog (Dec 15, 2007)

Hi Paul
Great news of your success with the Atalanta Rx and hearing more stations on the higher H/F bands.
I will pass your best wishes to my colleague TOM Stub, ex GTZM R/O
and shoreside tech.
When I originally asked him he said he could not remember what he had for breakfast that day never mind what the fault was as its 50 years ago
since he last working on Atalantas!! Anyway he did remember after all.
He and I were both at Riversdale tech together on pmg and radar courses before joining GTZM.
I do not know whether or not if Marconi kept serial numbers of their radio gear assigned to ships, but maybe best if you ask Ron Stringer
ex GTZM who is on this site as he has a vast knowledge of most things about GTZM. Enjoy your listening Paul. Cheers 73.s de ftf


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## Ron Stringer (Mar 15, 2005)

freddythefrog said:


> .... ask Ron Stringer ex GTZM who is on this site


Well the original delivery notes accompanying the equipments to the ship would have had the serial numbers recorded on them. A copy would have been kept in the Supplies Department or depot stores and the ship's file. However those records will have long been disposed of. At Chelmsford, after we moved from the MIMCo HQ building Elettra House, firstly to a MCSL site at Waterhouse Lane for a few years and then to Building 720 in the main Marconi New Street estate, all non-essential do***entation was dumped. 

This was for no other reason than that, with each move, the space we were allocated at our new location was a fraction of that which we were currently occupying. We could either accommodate essential people and equipment or the ac***ulation of several decades of paper records (which by then occupied a greater space than the much-reduced workforce). All paperwork not required to be kept by law, or directly connected to 'live' contracts, was simply skipped - several tons of it.

Once the records had gone there was an immediate saving to be made by redeploying the clerical staff involved in keeping them maintained. A win-win solution for the bean counters.

So there will be no existing record of which bit of kit went on each ship, interesting though such information would be to the likes of us and future industrial historians.


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## freddythefrog (Dec 15, 2007)

Hi Ron
Many thanks for that excellent piece of information ref GTZM and the unfortunate dumping of a sea of information.
I hope Paul in N.Z. reads this and it will save him searching in vain for the lost info re his Atalanta Rx.
Cheers 73.s de ftf


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## Paul Braxton (Jul 21, 2005)

Thanks for your informative post, Ron. It's more or less as I would have expected. If only all or some of that information about the Mimco equipment could have been archived on a computer hard drive. Ah well, I'm pleased the old girl is still completely operational after all this time. That's the main thing.

Thanks for your interest again, Freddy.

Paul


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## djringjr (Feb 11, 2008)

This is the best site for software defined receivers:
https://sdr.hu/

There's a map showing locations, but many locations are off on the map.

Best wishes,

David Ring
ex Radio Officer
U.S. Merchant Marine also at Tuckerton, NJ radio/WSC,


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## duncs (Sep 8, 2008)

I found the Atalanta rx very reliable, but the Mercury and Elettra had a habit of blowing a de-coupling capacitor in FS. After the first time it happened, all I did was sniff it out, then snip it out, not replaced. no prob.


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