# Esperance Bay



## Garysh (Oct 27, 2008)

Hi,

I've recently been reading about the ship "Esperance Bay" of the Australian Commonwealth Line, as my grandfather returned from Australia to the UK on her in 1928.

I've located the UK Inbound Passenger List for the return voyage, and this shows that he left the ship at Hull, UK.

All of the information that I've found so far for the ship indicates that Southampton was the normal UK port. I've not found any mention of Hull as a UK port of call.

Does anyone know if this Australia to UK service did call at Hull, or know how I can find out.

Thanks,
Gary


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## R58484956 (Apr 19, 2004)

Greetings Gary and a warm welcome to SN on your first posting. Bon voyage.


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## fred henderson (Jun 13, 2005)

*Welcome*

Welcome to the site Gary.

Australian Commonwealth Line was a disastrously loss making company owned by the Australian Government. In May 1928 the Government sold the company and its ships to Lord Kylsant’s newly formed White Star Line Ltd. The ships were transferred to the British register and a new organisation named Aberdeen & Commonwealth Line was created under the management of George Thompson & Co Ltd. It was only after Thompson reorganised the business that Southampton was established as its UK terminal port.

If your grandfather travelled in the early part of 1928 Esperance Bay would normally land its passengers in London. It is certainly probable that the ship continued up the East Coast to work cargo and may have carried your grandfather on to Hull, but this would of course have taken far longer than disembarking in London and continuing by train.

Fred(Thumb)


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## aleddy (Apr 8, 2006)

Thats interesting Fred, I thought that Passenger Liners would have only travelled the regular ports of call along the line of their prebooked passenger needs keeping to a strict timetable for turnaround.
Then again as you have said Bay Liners were a disasterous loss making company.
It was hoped that they would be the starting point for a great Australian Merchant Fleet.
Cheers
Ted


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## Garysh (Oct 27, 2008)

Thank you for the information.

The actual date on the passenger list (see attached file) is 9th June 1928, and it shows both Southampton and Hull as the ports of call. According to the passenger list, quite a few passenger left at Hull.

Note that the passenger list also shows the line as "Australian Commonwealth", rather than the new owner.

I also found it strange why the passengers didn't use the train. I guess it was cheaper to stay on the boat!

Thanks,
Gary


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## fred henderson (Jun 13, 2005)

aleddy said:


> Thats interesting Fred, I thought that Passenger Liners would have only travelled the regular ports of call along the line of their prebooked passenger needs keeping to a strict timetable for turnaround.
> Then again as you have said Bay Liners were a disasterous loss making company.
> It was hoped that they would be the starting point for a great Australian Merchant Fleet.
> Cheers
> Ted


Hello Ted

I have always found that the economics of the classic passenger liners to be of considerable interest. Despite the fact that they were the only means of intercontinental passenger travel, every company seems to have been dependent upon other income to sustain their services. The four main sources of support being: -
1.	Government Mail Subsidies – a considerable payment being made to the company to ensure that a specified regular timetable was maintained. These ships operated exactly as you describe Ted, in order to obtain the subsidy, not to satisfy the passenger needs.
2.	Emigrant traffic – often subsidised by the countries at both ends of the service, with little concern about the standards of passenger accommodation provided. These ships operated with passengers to the ports specified by the governments concerned. As the passenger flow was predominantly in one direction the ships frequently carried cargo to other ports.
3.	Empire administrators and military personnel – as and where required by the Governments involved, with accommodation also made available for civilian passengers.
4.	Express freight – if the line was not operating on a Mail Contract it would often close-off its ships’ passenger accommodation at the primary port of call and visit other cargo-only ports before returning to the primary port to embark passengers for the next voyage. This enabled the “hotel crew” to leave the ship for home leave, etc. Until the transfer of registry was completed the Bay ships continued to have Australian crews and seemingly continued to carry passengers wishing to remain on board after the first UK port of call.

Regards

Fred(Thumb)


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## aleddy (Apr 8, 2006)

Thanks Fred, I expect that I should have tried to get my head into the early 20th century thinking when everything was slower adn readjusted without fear or favour and if one was well heeled that was another story
Cheers
Ted


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## Richard Maskiell (Apr 4, 2007)

Gary, this voyage was the Esperance Bay's final sailing under Australian ownership. Her first voyage under Aberdeen & Commonwealth ownership was in August. My guess is that the 2 months between her arrival in UK in June and sailing in August probably involved a refit, perhaps at Hull.

There is a book by McDonnell "Build a Fleet, Lose a Fleet" which gives an account of this disastrous venture.


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## Garysh (Oct 27, 2008)

Hi Richard,
Thanks for that suggestion.

I've just checked the UK inbound passenger lists for a couple of the previous voyages during 1927 / 1928, and they all visited Hull, so it appears that Hull was a regular port of call at that time.

Thanks,
Gary


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## John.H.Clark (Apr 20, 2007)

in the late 50's I was told that at the end of their careers the Bay boats were in a very poor state, with no passenger allowed to view the galley 
John


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## aleddy (Apr 8, 2006)

Being a regular port of call and possibly stopping over for a refit would explain any breakdown in time table committments.
The book you mentioned Richard is that a UK or Australian publication, I will launch a search for it on Amazon name of author and publisher is always a big help
Cheers
Ted


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## Richard Maskiell (Apr 4, 2007)

Alan,

The book is an Oz publication, full details are: Captain RJF McDonell "Build a Fleet, Lose a Fleet" (The Hawthorn Press, Melbourne 1976) ISBN 0-7256-0165-5.


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## harmanweston (Nov 11, 2008)

*Hi Gary*



Garysh said:


> Hi,
> 
> I've recently been reading about the ship "Esperance Bay" of the Australian Commonwealth Line, as my grandfather returned from Australia to the UK on her in 1928.
> 
> ...


Hi Gary

As a young lad of 7 years of age we sailed on the Esperance Bay from Sydney to England in either early December or late November 1931, we were due to land at Southampton but late in the voyage we were informed that we would be landing at Hull, somewhere I have a Menu card singed by various passengers, we arrived Hull in January 1932
best wishes, Harman Smith-Weston


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## rdrawnsley (May 14, 2018)

Hello - I have just joined. I am looking for passenger lists on the Esperance bay between 1930 and say 1935. My father, David, Rawnsley, who is dead was said to have traveled from Sydney to England on her some time during that time and we would like to know when and who with. Thanks


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## PETER HIGGINSON (Jan 31, 2021)

Garysh said:


> Hi,
> 
> I've recently been reading about the ship "Esperance Bay" of the Australian Commonwealth Line, as my grandfather returned from Australia to the UK on her in 1928.
> 
> ...


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## PETER HIGGINSON (Jan 31, 2021)

Hi,

I have also just registered on the Ships Nostalgia website.

My father Charles Higginson travelled from the UK to Australia, I'm assuming to Sydney, in 1925 (possibly September) on the Esperance Bay, That would have been three and a half years after it was launched. I was hoping to find the travel lists for that year. Would sombody be able to advise me on how to go about this?
Many thanks,
Peter


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